The latest thing to take the Internet by storm, and the presidential campaign by storm, and the imagination of meme-makers everywhere by storm, is the video shot of Hillary Clinton collapsing into her vehicle. It was a moment filled with . . . moment, you might say.
Now of course our public discourse immediately began chundering all sorts of things in response to this, and so we are not lacking commentary on it. But I do want to say just a couple of things about all this that might be helpful to Christians.
Moments like this separate those who hate what Hillary Clinton stands for, and who want to oppose her as an evil woman, and those who are simply filled with spite and malice (for whatever reason). Those in this latter group may have begun their anti-Hillary careers innocently enough, but they are ending them filled with bile.
The responses therefore range from a thoughtful “this should be interesting” to a cackling schadenfreude. And then, on the other side of both of these, we have the indignant chiders and rebukers—those who want to say that this is the kind of thing we shouldn’t even notice. “It is not a policy issue, and anyway I thought you guys were supposed to be pro-life.”
Scripture has something to say to all of us in this.
“Rejoice not when thine enemy falleth, And let not thine heart be glad when he stumbleth: Lest the Lord see it, and it displease him, And he turn away his wrath from him” (Prov. 24:17–18).
The Bible flatly prohibits chortling about things like this. You may not. Thou shalt not. Do not let your heart be glad when she stumbleth, yea, when she falleth into the van. That’s plain enough. But what is the reason given? The reason is that if you think it is possible that the Lord might be in the process of taking out someone who is evil, you do not want to provoke Him into changing His mind through your unseemly behavior on the sidelines with the pom-poms.
In short, your reaction must not be carnal. There is a carnal kind of spite that is prohibited, and there is a carnal kind of sentimentalism that is prohibited. There is the malice that just erupts when someone you personally detest has something bad happen to them—and a lot of people on the hard right do not know what spirit they are of. But then there are the sob sisters over here on the kinda-right who do not know what spirit they are of either. They don’t know that the reason you are to guard your heart against petty spite is because God is the one who lifts up and who throws down, and we should want Him to finish the job.
Hillary Clinton has a lot to answer for. She really is an enemy of God. Our prayer should be that all enemies of His be destroyed. Our prayer in the first instance is for her, that she come to that destruction in repentance—for God-given repentance really is the true destruction of a sinner. But if in the providence of God, the destruction begins to unfold apart from any repentance on her part, our response must not be the kind of laughter or finger-pointing that marks malicious celebration, but rather the kind of fear that makes our ears tingle. Hillary’s Clinton’s life, down to the business of “managing” this story, has been a tissue of lies. Those lies are heaped and mounded, like a pyramid of wadded-up Kleenex, and our God is a consuming fire.
Neither spite, nor sentiment. The stakes are too high.
How do we respond?
A holiday greeting from Evan McMullin!!
https://twitter.com/Evan_McMullin/status/775479004426039296
Thanks. Duly rebuked, but that was helpful.
Amen, Pastor.
This is a good word.
Well said, Pastor…Amen. Thank you for the Biblical reminder of how we are to conduct ourselves on this occasion.
“The reason is that if you think it is possible that the Lord might be in the process of taking out someone who is evil, you do not want to provoke Him into changing His mind…”
Oh, Lord, forgive my rejoicing at Hillary Clinton’s malady, but, please don’t change Thy mind. You were right the first time.
Good reminder. I repent.
Just as Jesus rebuked the justice-thirsty Pharisees for their self-righteousness, Solomon recognized that the LORD hates the victor gloating over the downtrodden–even if the downtrodden is fully guilty. We are called to be different than the world, to pray for and love our enemies. But this is only half the story as the Christian must not lessen the true evil which the Jezebel of our age promotes…abortion, sodomy, feminism, racial amalgamation, etc. Her literal downfall is the working of a righteous and just God. Until she repents, truly she deserves imprecations. Psalm 69 says this about God’s enemies… 22 May… Read more »
“racial amalgamation”?
Honestly, what do you think, katecho? Are account like Eagle_Eyed really D.C. liberals trying to discredit Christianity? Or are they in earnest? And if they are in earnest, how do they get WiFi in their backwoods bunkers anyway?
What happened to the Israelites exiled to Assyria?
Uh oh! Here comes the ten lost tribes and Herbert W. Armstrong to the rescue!
Huh. Never heard of that guy. How special.
Anyway I was referring to the normal-person view that the Israelite captives were absorbed into the other ethnic groups in the Assyrian empire and lost their group identity.
Oh no! They lost their group identity! That sounds … that sounds exactly like the Scots, the French, the Sicilians, the Welch, and the Germans, all who lost their group identity by moving to America and eventually creating my kids. TURRIBLE INDEED
I don’t expect immigrants or descendants of immigrants to feel any loyalty towards people actually from here. So your attitude doesn’t surprise me in the least.
So I’m not sure what tiny fraction of the human race you believe to be unaffected by this mixing that you find so horrible. I guess your genes have passed through the millennia with nary a scratch, eh?
My great-grandfather was Scottish but the rest of my family is Southerners. I’m certainly not saying that all immigrants have divided loyalties. But it’s not surprising when they do.
I don’t think I do. Except for my insistence on the superiority of Kraft Dinner, my fondness for Justin’s hair (Trudeau not Bieber), and my insistence that Canada won the War of 1812.
You live in LA though; have you ever visited America?
Am I correct in guessing you would think NYC and Chicago don’t count? How about Seattle?
Since you ask, you seem to have some intuition for the answer. There’s a lot of different Americas. The one that gets overlooked is “places where most of the people are mostly descended from colonists”.
Anyway my main point is that from what I’ve read about LA, and seen in a brief visit there, it’s more like an overgrown shopping mall than a place that can inspire loyalty.
I think that in an interesting observation. I suspect that for many Angelenos, the loyalty is directed to the particular neighborhood and may be based on an ethnic or “lifestyle” identity. Toluca Lake is hip and cool, Fairfax used to be Jewish Orthodox, West Hollywood is gay, my own is tough, working-class Hispanic, and Little Armenia is–well, you can figure that out. For some, it is identification with The Industry ( you never need specify which), cultural events, or even sports teams. For myself, I love the climate (except when the temperature goes over 90 degrees), the cultural history, the… Read more »
Makes sense. Anyway, when I think about immigrants, loyalty, and LA, this always comes to mind. http://articles.latimes.com/2011/jun/26/sports/la-sp-0626-plaschke-gold-cup-20110626
I so much wish that people wouldn’t do that. A large part of my heart will always be Canadian. What has prevented me from becoming a citizen much earlier was my fear that I could not conscientiously take the oath abjuring all loyalty to the Queen, maple syrup, and ending my sentences with “eh”? I was always amazed by my American friend who told me to just cross my fingers. But I learned within a few days of arriving here that social expectations regarding the expression of patriotic feeling are very different and that it is offensive to display openly… Read more »
Yeah. The stereotype of people living in dirt-floored maple sugar shacks actually applies to Vermont, not Canada…
Please tell me you’re not in Boyle Heights.
Or thinking of moving there.
They’re out for honky blood in Boyle Heights.
Gringo, not “honky”. No, I don’t. I live in the Valley which would be unrecognizable to the returning GIs who bought tract houses here. I have never suspected that anyone was out for my blood. In fact, I have often found the opposite which sometimes embarrasses me. I am often the only white woman riding the bus. People give me their seats, even when they are not much younger than I. And I don’t think it is merely because I smile sweetly at them.
They say gringo.
I say honky.
I forgot to mention your first point. I suppose you could say that LA was developed by colonists and their descendants. The Spanish friars would certainly qualify, as would the middle class, Protestant white people who came to buy cheap land and enjoy eternal sunshine at the turn of the twentieth century. How any of them survived without air conditioning is a mystery. I have a sister in the Pacific Northwest, and have therefore spent a lot of time in eastern Washington and Sandpoint, Idaho. I found the people to be indistinguishable from the Canadians with whom I grew up.… Read more »
Since humanity started on the other side of the ocean (no matter which origin story you believe) then nobody has any loyalty toward anyone who actually exists, by your definition. Nobody’s “from here” in that sense.
I think he’s hoping I cut my children to pieces and scatter them among the European nations. That’d be a great start.
Pulse Orlando just got shot up by people with a coherent group identity. I would say “take it up with them” but they will kill you with pleasure–NOT TURRIBGLE INDEED as you die because of your ideology.
So what you’re saying is that group identity can be a very, very bad thing. Agreed!
Different groups behave in different ways. Yes, Islam is incompatible with Western Civilization and Christianity. If you are an Islamicist, then Christianity is an evil. Why is this so hard for you to accept? As a Christian, you cannot say that identity must go away. He is, He never changes, He is Truth….. We are in Him. We have an identity in Him. Identity is (whatever the word is that says things are neither moral nor immoral–they are outside morality). We can say that different religions (identity), peoples (identity) , cultures (identity) are good or bad for us (identity) We… Read more »
Timothy: I think you may have misplaced the plot of this entire conversation, which began with “Beagle_Eyed” making the wild claim that something called “racial amalgamation” is a “true evil.” Finding our identity in Christ and in His Church is absolutely an antidote to the race animosity being perpetrated on the left and the right.
Possibly Jon.
I have a cold/bug. These topics will come up another time and we can discuss when I have a functioning brain.
cheers.
t
You realize of course that they did not lose their integrity as a people because they were absorbed into the pagan empires, but that they were absorbed into the pagan empires as judgment for losing their integrity?
Shh! Next thing, these big-government race-a-mentalists will discover Ruth and Rahab and completely lose their plotline.
Ruth and Rahab are important people to remember and certainly reveal that tribe and nation aren’t the most important things. But remember that Amalek is in the Bible too.
So make up your mind. Is “racial amalgamation” a “true evil” along the lines of sodomy and abortion like “Beetle_Eyed” states above?
I think that the government-mandated destruction of white communities and the pro-miscegenation propaganda so prevalent today are true evils. I don’t think interracial marriage per se is evil.
Ha!
Clever pun.
I also say:
“racial amalgamation“?!?
How did that sneak into your list of evils?
Seen South Africa lately?
Is the problem in South Africa that the races amalgamated too much?
We definitely need a government program to put a stop to that nonsense.
Not at all.
Per my reading South Africa is no longer Dutch, with all that entails.
So, the Dutch were lousy evangelists. Agreed!
What all does being Dutch entail?
Then if the problem isn’t racial amalgamation, then this is in no way a response to Jon and katecho’s query.
Perhaps the problem in South Africa is not that it is no longer Dutch, but that it is no longer Bantu? I mean, who really upset the apple cart there?
Hi Jane.
I failed to look up the definition of amalgamation. Its meaning is 180 degrees from what I supposed it meant. I apologize for my failure.
Let’s discuss another time. I am ill with a cold/bug and rational thought is too much effort at the moment.
cheers.
t
Race. Peoples are different. Black people are different from white people. If I notice that White people built Detroit and that it now lies in ruins with the influx of black people, then you will call me racist. If I notice that White south africa was prosperous and that it is now a socialist hell-hole and this coincided with the displacement of white’s, you will call me racist. If I notice that Hiroshima was destroyed by an atom bomb and was rebuilt into a beautiful city by the Japanese and then notice that the beautiful city of Detroit today looks… Read more »
Do you understand that there are options besides “insistence on mono-culture globalism” and blaming everything on “racial amalgamation?”
Presumably so; what’s your basis for excluding it? It’s at least a correlating factor.
I don’t see that the races have amalgamated to any discernible degree in SA, that’s why I exclude it as an important factor. Sort of the way I don’t consider a high beef diet an explanation for any health-related phenomena in India. ;-)
Timothy, is a well educated black from an upper middle class home qualitatively different from his white counterpart? Are you assigning race as the only explanation for cultural differences? One of my surgeons is both black and Jewish. He graduated from the Ivies before the days of affirmative action. Would a population of similar blacks destroy Detroit?
Let’s discuss another day, Jillybean. I am recovering from a cold/bug and do not feel like thinking. (:
Poor Timothy! Feel better soon.
One sentence should clear up all your questions, Jilly. Race does not equal Culture. Race really means nothing; CULTURE is paramount. Blend in as many different races with all their interesting angles, quirks, and offerings that you want. If you do NOT blend in their cultures, you will have one of two natural consequences: segregation, or violence. If you DO blend in the cultures, you will also have one of two natural consequences: amalgamation, or dominance with flavors of the rest. Now, here’s my take. Christ’s Kingship should be the dominating influence that all our minor cultural differences color and… Read more »
You are so right. And that only a truly Christian outlook can make us willing to curb our own resentment at times. Living in an incredibly multicultural neighborhood, I have learned that I must be more willing neither to take nor to give offense. I can’t blast Vivaldi at the neighbors while expecting them not to blast rap right back at me.
I actually feel a bit sorry for her in this – not that the lies have been caught out, but in wondering whether the lies are coming directly from her, or from those around her who want her to win so much that they won’t let her show weakness. As the political steamroller plows ahead, it’s often the machine’s self-preservation that becomes important, not the politician’s.
Thanks JakeJ.
I was driving a good bit yesterday and listened to the cable news chanels: So with about sixty million children dead and almost twenty TRILLION in debt to show for it, all they have to talk about in a presidential election is a stumble and how to properly use the word deplorable!
“Chundering”. For those wondering it’s an Aussie-ism derived from the nautical “Watch under!”, the cry indicating that something is about to fall on your head, a block maybe or a marlinspike. Now it means mainly vomit or to vomit and aptly describes the internet process, the very thing we are engaged in now.
God, please magnify your glory in HRC. Humble her and make her love it and love you. Destroy her rebellion in any case, and ours too. If you can do Nebuchadnezzar you can do anyone.
One of the reasons I read Wilson is it expands my vocabulary. The word I had to look up today was the very one you mentioned. Aussie slang can be very “colorful.” Fair dinkum, Rob Steele.
Thank you ~
A few weeks ago, I mentioned her health in a comment here. There was a bit of discussion. It’s hard to distinguish the truth from tinfoil hat stuff and the MSM’s protective narrative (it was allergies..no it was the heat…alright, it was pneumonia but she got better!). Regardless, I thought there were serious issues before this incident. Given her lifelong pattern of deception and lying (both white and flagrant ones), the only path to the truth is to watch and see what happens next.
This is helpful Doug, and I agree with your thoughts. The irony is that some of those who cackle at her current predicament will be the same that hate her for her deplorable (that word) cackling at the death of Muammar Gaddafi. Now he was a wicked man, yet anyone who knows the manner in which he died and then sees the manner in which Mrs C cackled at that death will wonder just how much her conscience has been seared with a hot iron. We sure don’t want to exhibit that kind of response. However, the Scriptures do sometimes… Read more »
But God will break you down forever; He will snatch you up and tear you away from your tent, And uproot you from the land of the living. Selah. — Psalm 52:5 Perhaps a difference is that, in Psalm 52, it appears that God has already completed His judgment, and rested (Selah), before the laughter begins? In the moment of judgement itself, it seems the most appropriate response is a fearful silence. I have a sense that in Hillary’s case, there is a whole lot further for her to fall than just into the van. (On the other hand, Wisdom… Read more »
Deprecating psalms …..
?
Amen! Now there’s some darn good preaching.
Never mind Hillary, those are words of wisdom for all aspects of our lives. Forgiveness can be a nasty business, but we really do have to learn how to take it beyond, “oh Lord, please just let me watch…”
The good news is that He knows our hearts. The bad news is also that He knows our hearts…
The Bible flatly prohibits chortling about things like this. You may not. Thou shalt not. Do not let your heart be glad when she stumbleth, yea, when she falleth into the van. That’s plain enough. But what is the reason given? The reason is that if you think it is possible that the Lord might be in the process of taking out someone who is evil, you do not want to provoke Him into changing His mind through your unseemly behavior on the sidelines with the pom-poms. If you’re white, that is. If you’re a black “conservative” or black Bernie… Read more »
40 Acres, You need to work a little harder at accurate representation. Or perhaps I am wasting my time. Do you reason this way because you’re white? A little something from a previous post . . . “When you find, as you will, that black Americans have many more run-ins with the cops than do white citizens, you shouldn’t put on a shocked face. Blacks are around 12% of the total American population, and make up around 35% of the prison population. You will have to give some account of this. If you are a liberal, you will blame white… Read more »
“you will undertake the task of “rebuking them sharply” so that they might be sound in the faith.” Rebuking them sharply? You mean like this, Doug? In the last generation 13 million black children have been dismembered, at rates much higher than the rates of white dismemberment. Many of their bodies were sold for parts. Of those who are allowed to live, who are granted entrance into this tolerant society of ours, about 58% will grow up without their biological father. This is an illegitimacy rate that is somewhere north of grotesque. There are about 2.2 million male prisoners in… Read more »
Roses are red,
Violets are black,
FAAAK is trolling again,
Always on the attack.
Dave, you’ve got to insult his mother or call him a gay or something if you’re going to be effective in any way. Right now, you look like you’re just spitefully tagging along. Don’t be like that, bruh.
I thought maybe Dave was his herald, or something.
That would be great, but he’d have to post right before 40 instead of after.
My sincere apologies that my poem didn’t hit home. After all, I am an award winning Roses are red poet. I will leave the FAAAK trolling to you all.
Roses are red,
Violets are black,
FAAAK is trolling again,
Always on the attack.
Dude, lighten up, will ya?
My preacher reads this blog, for crying out loud.
You mean the guy who runs your poker games?
That’s his pastor’s wife. Do you not think women are capable of such?
Sexist.
Wilson wrote: If you are a racist, you will blame the incorrigible nature of blacks. On this blog, we’ve seen 40 ACRES, Barnabas, and ashv attempt to place blame on the nature of blacks as a race, as if other races were immune to the affects of socialist handouts. Poor whites are certainly capable of succumbing to the same temptation, with very similar results on the family. This is why it is foolish to boast in race. Socialism is bad for everyone, not just blacks. This doesn’t mean that those who give in to the temptation of “free stuff” are… Read more »
In other words… “Democrats are the real racists”.
ashv wrote:
The point was more general. Democrats may seek to pigeonhole along racial lines, appealing to the unique nature of blacks, but so does ashv, and that doesn’t make him a Democrat.
You have understood nothing I have said.
On this blog, we’ve seen 40 ACRES, Barnabas, and ashv
Aw, man, don’t lump me in with them two freaks!
I’ve witnessed and witnessed to them the salvation message, but they just won’t listen.
But I’m not weary in well-doing, so here it comes again:
If thou shalt believe in thine heart in Martin Luther King of Kings, and shalt confess with thy mouth that Democrats are the real racists, thou shalt be saved.
It is not a coincidence that the biggest bum-rushers on this blog use pseudonyms. It’s awfully easy to be rude when hiding behind an internet tag and avatar. If you actually believe all your controversial positions, why not defend them as yourself instead of a fiber-optic insulated alter ego?
Zachary, why don’t you publish your employer, position, and the name and contact information of your supervisor.
But before you do, where do you think homosexuals will spend eternity, and why, and what is your opinion of #blacklivesmatter?
I’m not sure I catch your drift. My only point is that internet anonymity is the enemy of honest and reasonable discussion.
It’s awfully easy to be rude when hiding behind an internet tag and avatar. If you actually believe all your controversial positions, why not defend them as yourself instead of a fiber-optic insulated alter ego? You’re using–some might say hiding behind–the default avatar that disqus gives users. How do I know that “Zachary Hurt” is even your real name? You’re much more likely to police your own language so as to fit within culturally-defined windows of acceptability–we can call this “honest and reasonable conversation”–if you just throw all your personal information out there, “Zachary.” Or, are you going to continue… Read more »
That’s a fair point, Wesley. And I suppose that’s the basic problem with internet discourse in general. You never know for sure who’s who in the zoo.
However, I do think using a real name (as I have, fyi :)) does help. Some of the people who read this blog know me, and so using my real name does create a level of accountability — even if for people who don’t know me personally my name is as meaningless as an invented moniker.
It’s not a coincidence that the people most eager to say what’s fashionable complain about pseudonyms. ;-)
True. Criticizing you or Kanye West here isn’t exactly a risky proposition. But still, pseudonym-protected rhetoric sure seems to be far less circumspect than the alternative, and I think that’s a bad thing for everyone involved.
I would use my real name, but it won’t fit – it’s actually 40 ACRES AND A KARDASHIAN MELLENCAMP.
LOL
Has anyone checked on Thabiti Anyabwile?
He must be absolutely despondent over Hillary fainting.
I have to wonder–will this be the final straw for people like him? After the email scandal and now this, how much more lying and deception will they tolerate? At least they can write-in “Ron Burns” or something when they vote…
Amen. She needs to last until the election lest we get someone more competent replacing her.
A good reminder. But it occurs to me that this wasn’t like Saul being wounded in an attack by the Philistines. She could have stayed home and gotten the care she needed. As it is, she done brought this on herself.
Is it ok to pray that both she and Trump are forced to resign due to health problems? 300 million people in this country and those two are who we came up with?
I know the fat pear shaped orange 70 year old Trump is the healthiest human to ever run for office but one can hope.
Wait wait wait….
You told us Trump would never become president. Are you backing down on that now?
Oh, I still think he is going to lose. But that still gives us a democrat. I would like an actual conservative to be in the race.
You’re consoling yourself with silly fairy tales if you think any other person on the Republican team was going to win the election.
Haha.
Trump is pulling in a solid 42% in the polling data. That is so horrible. Literally any other candidate would be crushing Hillary right now. Clowns like you picked the one human being in this country that was capable of losing to that lady.
Histo, even Doug has said that Trump has a fair chance of winning. Douglas. Wilson. Clinton would be devouring ANY of the other 16. Trump is the only one that has had the courage and fortitude to not back down in the face of being called daily “racist,” “Hitler,” “Nazi,” etc… He’s stood up for his supporters when the Blue team calls them “deplorables” and whatever “-phobe” is sparking the most “outrage” at the moment. In fact, here’s a headline from WaPo: Don’t compare Donald Trump to Adolf Hitler. It belittles Hitler. You go ahead an obstinately lie and say… Read more »
Anybody and everybody is free to talk about how terrible Trump is.
But you ought to have the honesty and decency of character to admit that he’s the only one able to take this on and not cower in the corner.
Trump’s on the offense, while Hillary, that strong women, has to send in her husband and the man who beat her back in ’07 to do her job for her.
He is not on offense. He is on self destruction mode. All he had to do is be silent and he would be up 10%. Instead every news cycle includes some insane, innane and conspiracy theory inspired madness that distracts from the fact that Hillary is the worst candidate the DEMS have ever run.
Wesley: “Clinton would be devouring any of the other 16” What the fudge are you talking about? What about 42% do you not understand? Look at Romney, McCain and Dole (the worst GOP candidates in recent history) and they all did WAAAAY better than Trump is doing. I disagree with Doug Wilson but if he is right and Trump does have a chance it has absolutely nothing to do with Trump being superior to the other 16 and every thing to do with the fact that the democrats picked the one person who people hate almost as much as Trump.… Read more »
Histo, it’s remarkable that the 16 other candidates who were all better than Trump, couldn’t manage to beat him.
I’ll let you have the last say in this exchange. Your silliness and obstinacy warrants no further reply.
Are you really this ignorant as to how the electoral process works?
You do realize that often the candidate who wins the nomination is not the best general election candidate right? It is a classic problem and it is why often parties do their best to control the outcome. In the primary it makes sense to make dumb statements about mexicans being rapists. But that makes it hard as heck to win the general. Even Trump sees that and has flip flopped on immigration.
Every candidate of the 16 was polling better than Trump in the general.
I love that you think attacks on the GOP candidate are worse this year. They always call GOP Nazi’s. They even did it with moderate McCain. The difference between the other times the media did it and this time is that this time it is sort of true. Trump is closer to a fascist than he is to a Reagan small government conservative.
Trump is swinging 42% (when even McCain got 46%) because when they called McCain a Nazi everyone knew it was just the liberal media…. when the media calls Trump a Nazi, people say…. “that sounds about right.”
Odd….it almost sounds like a conspiracy, doesn’t it? MWAHAHAHAHA!
(Last week, I tongue-in-cheek postulated that Trump was a set-up to get Hillary elected because he was the only candidate Hillary could beat–which is pretty much exactly the words you just used. 40AAAK and Wesley went ballistic calling me a nut-case, thus granting me the great joy of having trolled the trolls.)
I don’t want a democrat or republican. I pray that God would raise up Godly leaders instead.
Agree. But not sure how you could be a Godly man and a democrat.
Let us know how that works out for you!
And then what? A bi-partisan Mitt Mormney-John Kerry ticket saves the day? Or maybe 4 more years of B. Hussein?
Romney = million times more conservative than Trump.
I held my nose to pull the lever for Romney. He had flip flopped on abortion and health care before running and that was just too liberal for me. Then came Trump. Trump filp flopped on abortion and health care too. And gay marriage. And transgender. And on Hillary Clinton. And on free markets. And on Eminent Domain. And on constructionist judges. And he has a porn star wife to top it all off!
Yeah….. never thought I would be nostalgic for a candidate I could hold my nose to vote for.
Garbage. Romney got more liberal every day the election went on, and he’d do nothing on immigration. And let’s not forget Romneycare.
He’s a pure milquetoast neocon sellout…nothing more. And electing him would just encourage the GOP to keep nominating more Romneys, McCains, Doles, etc.
Name one issue that Romney is more liberal than Trump on. I can name many issues that Trump is more liberal than Romney on.
Plus… porn star wife.
How can I stop the GOP from nominating Trumps?
It’s too late. Religious conservatives aren’t significant in this election. Nobody is attacking them or trying to pander to them. Y’all got eclipsed by a cartoon frog.
Didn’t your boy pander then hell out of liberty college and claim to be a Christian over and over? I think I remember him claiming that the bible was his favorite book? I also remember him talking about how much he “The evangelicals” loved him. Your boy was one huge ball of pandering during the primary? When he got the nomination, didn’t he pander by releasing a list of judges he would pick to try to lock up the Christian vote? Seems to me that your boy proves your own dumb point wrong. But you are used to people proving… Read more »
Sure. Trump isn’t anti-evangelical, but he’s not competing in the Conservative Olympics like Cruz was.
He wasn’t just not anti evangelical, he put on the full press of evangelical pandering on. Liberty, two Corinthians, Bible = favorite book, interviews on CBN, professions of how Christian he is, discussion on his “room full of bibles” (seriously). He pandered like crazy.
And yes, so did Cruz. And Huckabee. And Jindal. And Walker. They all did.
You said no one pandered to the Evangelicals. But in fact, they all did. So, you were not a little wrong, you were 100% wrong. As usual.
The primaries are over, if you didn’t notice.
I’m sorry, I forgot your procedure.
Step 1: Make ridiculous statement (“No one is pandering to the evangelicals”)
Step 2 : Be shown how ridiculous that claim is (with evidence that Trump and everyone else pandered like crazy to the evangelicals)
Step 3 : Attempt to deny the evidence (well…. Trump wasn’t anti evangelical)
Step 4 : Be shown more evidence (additional Trump pandering quotes)
Step 5 : Change the subject (well, its not the primaries anymore)
Waaa waaaaa. Haha!
Well…., in the good side of the unintended consequences department , even North Korea would develope a sense of humor, if there was a president Biden!????
( aka, “Uncle creepy”)
I think that at his age and weight (267 pounds), he is a heart attack waiting to happen. I don’t wish that on him or on anyone. But I think we should be paying a lot of attention to both candidates’ VP choices.
Best result I can imagine is Trump winning and then dying immediately after swearing in. I do not love Pence but I will take him over all other alternatives right now.
EDIT: Ok, given the nature of DOug wilson’s blog post and the true biblical commands of loving your enemies and all I should clarify….the BEST result would be Trump converting to the True Faith, repenting of his sins, and then reading some economic books to get educated.
Looks like jilly must’ve got banned.
Prolly the Jew thing.
Not likely, buddy. I have been distracted by the demands of Real Life.
Hillary has almost been indicted, has been caught lying over and over, has a horrible approval rating, and her health is horrible, has a horrible yelling speaking voice, has a weird rapy and creepy husband…… and she is STILL beating Trump.
Thanks Trump supporters for the great candidate. He is now tracking at 42% in the polling average. But of course, he was the “only candidate who could win.” haha!
Be careful!
Rejoice not when thine enemy falleth, And let not thine heart be glad when he stumbleth: Lest the Lord see it, and it displease him, And he turn away his wrath from him.
Who is my enemy in this case? Trump supporters? And they fell by what? Being spectacularly wrong? Not sure how my pointing out their spectacular level of stupidity in any way applies to that verse.
I was speaking to your comments throughout the thread. You do seem to hold a high level of animosity toward Trump and his supporters.
I do understand that verse better now though.
A heart cannot hold reverence for our Creator and at the same time despise his creation. There are two types of rejoicing in a fallen enemy. The evil heart rejoices in the humiliation of his enemy, but the good heart rejoices that God has ruled justly.
When we sin by rejoicing in our enemy’s fall, does that mean that God can no longer judge in our favor?
Hi JL, I think you are judging me falsely. The people I love the most are Trump supporters. My father. My friends. My church members. People I really care about. Doing evil. Trump is evil. Support for Trump has done a horrible evil to this country. My goal with the harsh words is one of reproof. My attempts at humor are intended to get Trump supporters to wake out of their blind support for a New York Liberal with a porn star wife and to turn back to Truth. Use of humor to change hearts is both good and biblical.… Read more »
You gotta realise — a lot of people support Trump not because they like him, but because they don’t like folks like you. (I certainly don’t have any desire to be ruled by a tycoon from New York if a better alternative is available. But I respect his success in destroying conservatism and attacking journalists.)
Ashv, having you not like me is something like a badge of honor for me. If you (a person who spouts demonstrably wrong opinions with pretty much every comment) were to in any way like me, I would be confident that I had erred and fallen from the straight path. Your conviction that I am wrong, is the clearest evidence that I am right. Woah to the one who ashv agrees with. Remember when you said Russia was the best example of a country that had not fallen into liberalism? Russia folks…. yes, the one that was communist for most… Read more »
Russia may be a good example, but Poland and Hungary have been better examples this year. Nevertheless: Russia, Poland and Hungary will exist in a recognisable form in 100 years. It’s highly unlikely that the USA will. Russian communism, despite its homicidal destruction, has proven far less deadly than Anglo-American communism.
Less destructive eh? Abortion is widespread. Church attendance is 7%. Alcoholism is widespread. Violence and corruption are everywhere. And poverty is widspread.
Not to mention the 100s of millions killed either directly or indirectly by Stalin and his ilk.
Are you intentionally making statements that can be shown to be wrong or is that just what you do?
And do not pretend that you do not support Trump. You would carry his bags around and laugh at all his dirty jokes if he asked you to.
You’ve attempted humor? Where?
Waa waaa. I knew that joke was coming as soon as I wrote what I did.
How about I attempted mocking of trump supporters who naively (like kids who think Santa is real) thought Trump was the best candidate to take on Hillary. It would be so cute if it was not destroying our country.
Trump is at 42% in the polling average and ou are still arguing that he was the only candidate who can win!
Thank you, Christian Histo. I didn’t see that at all. The way you said it here was beautiful, if I may be so bold. I apologize for falsely judging you! I’ve been thinking about this a lot, because I couldn’t understand the angst of some Cruz supporters, but I finally figured it out, I think. I took one foray into politics to stump for Ron Paul. When he didn’t win, I decided not to vote because I didn’t see a real difference between the two final candidates. I thought they were equally evil. I wonder if this parallels what some… Read more »
I would analyze it almost exactly the other way. Trump is an open fascist, likely a Russian agent, who got rich by not paying his workers or his creditors, and who just for good measure is being sued for statutory rape. What’s amazing is that he is up to 42%. Whatever negatives Clinton has pale in comparison to his.
Are you trolling?
Takes one to know one?
Are you trolling?
Takes one to know one?
smh
Haha. Well said. That is true too. Both candidates can thank their stars that the other person is running. Trump would be 20 % behind a decent opponent and Hillary would be 20% behind a decent opponent. It is like both parties combed the country to find the worst possible candidate and succeeded.
Actually, Histo, I’ll grant you that Trump brought in a lot of baggage that the other 16 didn’t have, though that’s a rough generalization because there was baggage. Jeb! was a Bush, and a weak one at that. Fiorina was naggy with an unbearable personality, and besides, running a woman for office as a “conservative” is anything but. Cruz was all-around disliked by everybody but his fans. Etc, etc, etc… So, perhaps in any other election year, a different R nominee would be mopping the floor, but I do believe that we’ve gotten to the point that the Left is… Read more »
Another point that should be brought out is that for a lot of Trump supporters–namely the more intellectual wing of the alt-right–they are loyal to Trump but view him as an instrument and starting point of their counter-revolution, as opposed to its culmination and goal. You could be very right about Trump losing–no denying that–but even so, the fact that someone like Trump, who is saying the things that Trump is saying, could become the R nominee and to the point of turning Ohio and Florida red in the polls is itself seen as a vitctory of sorts. Another positive… Read more »
“Someone like Trump”? A New York Liberal with a porn star wife and Center Left policy positions?
I should be encouraged why?
Did you hear he is pushing for paid maternity leave now? What a hardcore conservative he is! He just out flanked Hillary on the left. He should have picked Sanders as his running mate.
Do you remember when Schwartzenegger (sp?) led the Republicans to victory in California in a recall election? His supporters felt betrayed to discover that he governed from the left, and had the social values and beliefs of a movie star who has married into the Kennedys. Who could possibly have foreseen such a thing?
In their defense, they did vote for an Austrian.
Yep. I have thought of that often. Trump is the Schwartzenegger of this year.
May God take her out. Wilson’s praying otherwise or his inever atrimp ,might be i never? never?same donkeys to cheer when bin ladin “”died’, drinking extra beer watching bombs fall all over children in Iraq; but now ‘don’t rejoice’ over this piece of trash. No don’t rejoice but sing the dirge with me ‘a tiaket a tasket pray for a casket’
O, that there were a better connection between your brain and your fingers…
His fingers when voice commands work perfectly well I think
Someone explain to me how THIS post got ashv, Timothy, 40 acres, AND Eagle-eyed to all make Anti-Black or anti race-mixing comments???
Why does everything have to be blamed on Black people?
And when are these people going to stop posting here? Why do they keep congregating?
Biological race is real, and the denial of this truth is a sin. Hillary is full on board with anti-white racial politics under the inane notion that a diverse country full of Somalians and Guatemalans can maintain the civilization built by white Europeans. This will never happen. Furthermore because every failure of minorities is only further proof of “systemic white racism” in the eyes of the media/academia/government ruling class, as the country turns browner, the descendants of the men who built this country will shoulder more and more of the blame. As one of those descendants, I’m done playing nice.… Read more »
Would it be useless to ask you for Scripture in support of your first statement? Especially the second part? Given your premises, one might conclude it is folly. But sin? I love European civilization because it gave me gorgeous cathedrals, Bach fugues, Italian art, and the whole canon of western literature. It gave me trial by jury, cool science, Socratic dialogue, and Yorkshire pudding. It made probable my birth into a Christian family and my training in a Christian world view, which I do not define as pride of birth but rather a state of mind that puts others first,… Read more »
Fair enough, race denialism is in many cases folly instead of a willful act of defiance. I was hastily assuming people had access to the same information and experiences I have, which obviously isn’t the case. Yet there are certainly many people–otherwise intelligent and educated–who remain ardent anti-racists and race-denialists in spite of contrary evidence and use anti-racist presuppositions to blame whites for the troubles of minorities and therefore their denialism leads them to commit other sins, levy false accusations, promote unjust remedies, etc. Also remember scripture does not decry “racism” as sinful. The term is a 20th century neologism… Read more »
I think racist is not a useful word except as an insult. When a word comes to mean only “people whose outlook I think is deplorable,” it has lost any value. But while I tend to avoid the word, I believe there are people whose attitudes towards those of other races is sinful. Doug has covered this much better than I can. I do not believe that noticing racial differences is sinful, although I think our perceptions are often inaccurate, are based on small samples, and overly reflect our personal experience. I don’t care very much about anyone’s private attitude,… Read more »
You’re not totally on the wrong track here but you need to be careful. The point isn’t that whites never mistreat non-whites or that American society has never had unwise or unjust legal structures; rather it is that incorrect notions about human beings combined with a liberal-controlled social system has disastrous consequences for whites, their sovereignty, and their freedoms. What’s more relevant to the state of racial politics today–the violent arson of black churches by white Alabamans in the 1960’s or the violent attacks on white cops by black criminals and their enablers (BLM) in 2016? Which political figure has… Read more »
Furthermore, “racial amalgamation” was only one sin I accused Clinton of supporting, and the only reason I listed out her sins was to highlight her impending doom and the appropriateness of imprecations. An imprecation is a call for an enemy to fail, to be cursed, to be judged, etc. so that God’s will may triumph over evil. As an example, may Clinton’s aim to make it easier for abortionists to murder unborn children with scissors and vacuums be thwarted–and if God strikes her down before she can become president who is to question Him? This is the meat of the… Read more »
“An imprecation is a call for an enemy to fail, to be cursed, to be judged, etc. so that God’s will may triumph over evil.”
And grace is a recognition of the gift we have all been given. So, “For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.” Therefore cursing others and calling down God’s judgment upon them is rather unwise.
You are the last person who should be talking about what counts as wise or unwise judgement.
No. You are the last person. Literally the last person. Maybe the last mammal.
Lol! Now that’s the pot calling the kettle black. But if you won’t listen to my wisdom, at least listen to Wilson, he really does know of which he speaks.
Too bad the psalmists never read “The Gospel of ME” (quite the pun, I must say).
Your analogy of trees to human beings is in error. Different kinds of trees are different species, which are unable to interbreed and create fertile offspring. You cannot cross a pine tree with a palm tree. People of different “races” are on a continuum which we have arbitrarily based on skin color. Yes, there are minor differences in physiology, but we are all one species. More importantly, we all share common ancestry and, more importantly, a common Creator.
Why do I keep posting here? Because I used to be a conservative but have since discovered that there’s much more to the right of that position than I had been taught, and it’s more consistent with nature and Scripture. Most of my life I have seen Christians shackled to the political left with the chains of fear of being called racist. I want to see churches and families that are free to understand and pursue that which is good without having to stay within the bounds of what their deadly enemies allow them to think. I don’t harbour particularly… Read more »
I’ve taken you as pro-slavery and pro-segregation, and you say a lot of things very close to anti-intermarriage (while not saying it’s universally sinful). You’ve defended the southern slavery of Black persons and said that Confederate slaveowners have nothing to repent of, said that it was not sinful to participate in their slavery, and said that emancipation was neither wise nor just. You say things like “Bull Connor did nothing wrong” and “This problem all started since blacks became free. Black lives used to be expensive” and said that your response to a Black descendant of slaves who had been… Read more »
My point is that my views on race aren’t founded on an emotional reaction, but on the evidence that Black Americans aren’t capable of building or maintaining a civilisation at the same level as Whites, and that if they are going to live together peaceably in the same country, this will necessarily involve Whites ruling over and providing for Blacks, including White suppression of Black violence. (This can be seen in sub-Saharan Africa as well: Empire of Dust, etc.) I don’t think this condition is permanent (in particular I’m reminded of the recent cartoon with the Roman complaining about how… Read more »
I wish this could be rephrased as “in a democracy such as ours, what do we do with a permanent underclass in which the less intelligent, unable to compete for access to high quality education or well-paying jobs, are going to be prone to social pathologies that endanger themselves and society at large?”
Well, I think it’d be a problem even without democracy. But a solution would be more likely to be arrived at. (For an entertaining discussion of this, you might read this essay: http://unqualified-reservations.blogspot.com/2009/11/dire-problem-and-virtual-option.html I don’t find his science-fiction solution plausible or palatable, but it’s an interesting thought experiment.)
You’re speaking from historical ignorance. Until about 1000 years ago, a number of African civilizations (including in Mali, Ghana, Congo, Zimbabwe, and Ethiopia) had built and maintained civilizations far more meaningfully than northern Europeans ever had. And the difference between, say, Greeks and Scandinavians, or Romans and German barbarians, was vast. Not to mention the difference between Ethiopians and Igbo and Zulu. You can’t just create a mostly scientifically meaningless concept like skin color and then claim it shows sweeping things about all civilization. There were quite clear historical/geographical reasons why high agricultural output and the advanced capacity for city-building… Read more »
Until about 1000 years ago, a number of African civilizations (including in Mali, Ghana, Congo, Zimbabwe, and Ethiopia) had built and maintained civilizations far more meaningfully than northern Europeans ever had. I believe the scientific name for this view is “WE WUZ KANGZ“. Obviously the USA would be much better off now if it had never imported any Africans at all. But it’s no use wishing the present situation away. Centuries of Roman colonialism and oppression, tragically, turned Northern Europeans into civilised people. Fortunately we know better now and won’t subject Africa to such depredations any longer. Yes, there were… Read more »
So Leopold can completely destroy society in the Congo, kill 10,000,000 people and maim/debilitate just as many more, suck all the natural resources and profit out he can while decimating their infrastructure for four decades, and if a wasteland of a society continues after that fact, it’s all their fault? Obviously, Leopold isn’t the last bad thing to happen to or in Congo. We could keep going with this historical exploration. But you simply completely ignored that White domination and horrific White violence had largely CAUSED Congo’s present situation while calling on that exact remedy to fix it. And no,… Read more »
I agree with you on the Congo. I was taught that Leopold was so incredibly wicked that even his fellow imperialists put a stop to him.
Wasn’t the missionary activity directed at the Anglo-Saxons also the result of the pope sending St. Augustine of Canterbury? The story we were fed, perhaps in error, was that the pope (or perhaps the emperor, I can’t remember) seeing beautiful blond children in the marketplace, asked who they were. “Angles, my Lord.” “Non Angli sed Angeli,” replied the pope (or emperor) who was so disturbed by pagan angels that he sent a missionary forthwith.
Yes, I’ve heard the same story, though rather than being “disturbed”, the pope was a bit flippant about the whole thing.
And yes, St. Augustine of Canterbury was also part of the effort. I put more weight into what the Irish monks were doing, but both did have some degree of influence and worked among different peoples, so their efforts were to some degree complimentary.
I would separate a Roman missionary sent out by the Church as quite a different thing than “Centuries of Roman colonialism and oppression”, which is what ashv had attributed Anglo-Saxon civilization to.
On the other hand, it is probably the only Latin pun that everybody knows, so that is worth something.
I must have been late to the party. I literally only learned it a month or so ago. Perhaps I had heard it before, but it didn’t stick.
And, btw, when you use mockery like “WE WUZ KANGZ”, do you realize how that goes beyond your already openly vocal support for slavery, segregation, apartheid, and White domination, and perhaps might suggest that you really do have negative feelings towards Black people in addition to merely supporting all those interesting political policies?
Pastor Wilson, if being to the left of ashv makes you a “moderate”, then I shudder at the thought of where the right is on this issue today.
You discern anger and contempt correctly, but it’s directed at people like you.
Either you’re a very poor discussion partner, or you’re a liar.
You are replying directly to my question about your statement, “WE WUZ KINGZ”. If there is anger and contempt in your statement, as you admit, then it is obviously directed towards the people who can say, “WE” in that context.
Of course, perhaps your excuse is that you meant some other statement, and not the one which I was speaking directly about. But that would be nonsensical as an answer to a question I asked you directly about THAT statement.
Until about 1000 years ago, a number of African civilizations (including in Mali, Ghana, Congo, Zimbabwe, and Ethiopia) had built and maintained civilizations far more meaningfully than northern Europeans ever had.
So what happened to them?
They were destroyed by the white Christians in the Democratic party.
Literally every civilization has its rise and fall. The European, Asian, and New World kingdoms of that period aren’t around anymore either. As for what happened after 1500 or so, I already explained that in the comment you are replying to: “There were quite clear historical/geographical reasons why high agricultural output and the advanced capacity for city-building and conquest that came with it developed first in China and the Fertile Crescent, and why they then spread laterally first through east Asia and southern Europe before eventually reaching the rest of Europe. When Northern European and Sub-Saharan African persons first began… Read more »
Interesting to read the comments below as folks bite and devour each other over whether Trump is evil with a capital “E” or the savior of white America. I think both he and Hillary are exactly what we have asked for, longed for, and what we (as a nation) deserve. I think the Lord in His infinite wisdom knows that we are a stiff-necked people who will not repent of our pride and arrogance and turn away from our sins until such time as we have dug ourselves a hole big enough and deep enough to bury us and all… Read more »
Or that “we” are actually two different groups of people that won’t ever get along together, regardless of ruler.
Gotta disagree, ashv, since you used the word “ever.” We who believe in Jesus Christ will indeed get along when Jesus is our King and their will be no divisions based on the degree to which any of us are beige.
Sure. “in the foreseeable future”, then.
If there really is a Bizarro universe in which everything in this world exists but in its opposite form, I would probably really get along with Bizarro-ashv.
I can picture him. Insightful, thoughtful, and making statements that are hard to refute. That would be a cool dude.
disagree. As flawed and imperfect, Trump is a far better choice than anyone we’ve had since Reagan. Now, will he fold under the pressure of globalism/tower of babalism that infects the political trajectory of our nation…. I pray God sutains him…. an egotistical jerk, though, has a far-better chance humanly-speaking than a ‘nice’ upstanding satanic mormon like Mitt Romney.
“Trump is a far better choice than anyone we’ve had since Reagan.”
That’s conditionaly true depending on who ‘we’ is.
What if both candidates are masquerading as angels of light?
A most excellent perspective, Pastor. And yes, it’s easy to get this one wrong. The whole lineup of Biblical principles to love one’s enemy, do good to those who persecute, pray for, give water to…your ENEMY. It’s altogether too easy to miss that as we delight in their downfall and/or pray for their destruction. Toeing the line between imprecations and supplications is exceedingly difficult when the object is one’s enemies. God help us all!
thank you for this. I need the rebuke.