Epistolary Fun in February

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Pregnancy and Fat

Doug, interesting observation about the Isaac Watts hymn you quoted: ““Yet,” saith the Lord, “should nature change,
And mothers monsters prove,”
In fact, that’s what we’re seeing today. Not in an abstract sense, but in a literal sense. We are seeing mothers proving themselves to in reality be monsters. I believe it’s a manifestation of what the Lord prophesied when He said, “the love of many will grow cold”.
It’s one thing to recognize that as an abstract theological factoid; it’s quite another to actually witness and experience that, in some cases firsthand. I daresay that almost all of what we see happening today has that as a core component.
And it still hurts despite the reality of Watts’ contrast in the second half of that stanza. I believe most of those who are the recipients of this monstrous cooled down anti-“love” are hurt because of their utter helplessness and inability to change it, rectify it, or do anything about it whatsoever.
Anyway, not sure if any of that is either here or there, but that’s what came to my mind out of the Watts hymn you quoted.

grh

grh, yes. It is a grim and unhappy situation out there in many places, including ostensible Christian places.

Sinful Mind at Bay

Re: The Sinful Mind at Bay. I thought “No Quarter November” posts were limited to November. Perhaps you are preparing to launch “Speak the Truth in Love February?” I’ll buy a flag.

John

John, thanks much. But when every month becomes November, then no month is ever November. You know, always winter and never Christmas.
And although this has nothing to do with your letter, I do need to comment on the gif to the right. Not shown, but undoubtedly there, is a girl down below, the one he is showing off form.

Bridal Showers?

Thoughts on bridal showers when the couple is living together? Does your support for celebrating the wedding extend to pre-wedding festivities?

Nora

Nora, I wouldn’t call it “support for” but rather the “lawfulness of.” Showers are a form of communication, and if what is communicated is support for or approval of the sin itself, then a believer could not participate. But I can easily envision a situation where it would be lawful to participate—because everybody involved knew that the sinful cohabitation was ending.
Should a Christian attend a “bastard” baby shower?

Percy

Percy, same kind of thing as above. It depends. If it is the woman you persuaded during sidewalk counseling to not get an abortion, yes. If it is an insolent relative who would use the occasion to taunt you and all your middle-class scruples, no.

Actually a Big Deal

As I am getting married in a few months, one of the elders at my church offered to meet with me to discuss biblical principles for marriage. I jumped at the opportunity since he is much older and more experienced than I am (I am 23 and he is in his mid 80’s) and I thought I could learn a lot from him. However, when we met, I became concerned about some of the things he told me. Although he identified himself as a complementarian in some sense, he told me that the husband is not supposed to lead, the wife is not supposed to follow, the submission mentioned in Ephesians 5 and elsewhere is only mutual submission, and that the word “obey” should not be included in a wife’s wedding vows because it might offend non-Christian women attending the wedding, among other things. A lot of his arguments were based on semantic distinctions between words in English that do not reflect a major distinction in the Greek. For example, he made a big deal of the difference between the word “submit” and the word “obey.” He claimed that the Bible only says that wives should “submit” to their husbands, not that they should “obey” them, which is completely different. When I brought up 1 Peter 3:5-6, he acknowledged that this text did say “obey,” but he claimed that this text couldn’t possibly apply to us because it also says that a wife should call her husband “lord” and that that was “ridiculous.” When I asked him what he thought this text was teaching in his view, he could not give an alternate interpretation, but just said “well, we can’t decide just based on one verse.” I was alarmed that he was willing to say that what the verse right in front of him says is “ridiculous,” although I’m sure that if I asked him if he believe in biblical inerrancy, he would say yes. I also pointed out that the difference between “submit” and “obey” is just a matter of which translation you use and doesn’t reflect a distinction in the Greek. He dismissed this by saying “well I’ll have to look that up sometime” and held to his point.
How concerned should I be about the things that this elder told me? Our conversation was very respectful, and he did not call me names, demand that I change my views, or anything of that sort. If this was just another person, I would just let it go, but it does concern me a little bit that he is an elder. Although he is an elder, he does not preach, teach Sunday School, lead a small group, or anything of that sort. I do not believe that the elders who do preach and teach Sunday School would agree with him on these points. My church also published a position paper on complementarianism a few years ago (I do not believe he was an elder at the time) that seems to me to contradict what he told me on these issues, although I suspect he might claim that he is not really contradicting it. Should I just let this go or should I be concerned?

Will

Will, it sounds to me like one elderly elder got off the reservation. I would go on the basis of the church’s formal position. And I would also look for an opportunity to give the pastor a heads up.

Have You Read . . .?

Just curious to know if you know the science fiction author Cordwainer Smith, the pseudonym of Dr. Paul Linebarger, who died too young in the mid 1950’s.
Particularly, do you know the short story “The Crime and the Glory of Commander Suzdal”?
I consider it a critique of homosexuality and the pseudo-scientific “transgender” worldview.

Jack

Jack, I read one book of his, The Planet Buyer, back in 1986. I thought it was okay. Didn’t float my boat.

My Atheist Friend

I have a relationship with an atheist friend similar to the one you had with Christopher Hitchens. Our relationship consists mainly of debate and we appreciate each other’s sense of humor and lack of being overly sensitive just because disagreement exists. One minor difference might be that he used to be a believer in my church community and is now openly apostate. He recently moved back into my city and the wife and I were going to have him over for dinner when 2 John 1:10 came to mind. I was wondering if John’s directive to the audience then has any application for my situation? Did you ever have Hitchens into your home for hospitality? Does my situation make any difference with my friend being a former believer in my community who went apostate?

RS

RS, no, I don’t think 2 John applies. I believe that is referring to helping itinerant teachers (false teachers) by putting them up, and sending them on their way.

Friend Zone Question

This question is based on your book Get the Man. In the chapter “Lack of Communication is Key,” you discuss the problem with a man falling into the friend zone. Given the issues inherent in being in the friend zone, how would you suggest a young man move a long-standing childhood friendship into a romantic relationship? Have you addressed this in any of your books/blogs/videos? Thank you (and Nancy) for helping me find my way to living biblically (and trying to provide tools for my children) after having been raised in a non-Christian home.

Holly

Holly, I would suggest that he show his hand. Ask her out, ask for her dad’s phone number, whatever suits the situation.

Tired of all the Sesquipedalianism

I have been very interested in what you have to say about all topics for a long time. I first heard you speak at a Desiring God Conference in 2010, I believe. I greatly appreciate your wisdom and have gained insight about post millennialism from your excellent book as well as your messages on YouTube.
You are brilliant! I am not, but I appreciate your discernment into what is happening in today’s culture every time I hear your podcast.
However, sometimes I don’t understand the details as much as I would like to, and as a result, I become frustrated. Every now and then, would you add a sentence or two of explanation for those of us who don’t have an IQ of 150+? I would love to comprehend just a bit better than I do because the better I absorb your message the better I am able to share it with those who will not make the effort to listen to a podcast but just might be moved to take a stand if they heard it from a friend. Just sayin’!
Most gratefully yours in Christ,

Suzanne

Suzanne, thanks. I will try to be better.

Thanks for the Suggestion

There’s a relatively new channel on YouTube called MindShift. He’s an atheist who has a pretty substantial following and he’s pumping out a lot of content that goes over my head and I don’t really have the tools mentally to work through his arguments. Would you or someone around Canon Press be willing to interact with his material and offer a Christian response? Thank you.

Eric

Eric, thanks for the idea.

The Baptism of Russia

hope you’re doing well. My husband and I have recently come to agree with your conclusions regarding baptism after reading “To a Thousand Generations.” We are very grateful for that book, and we thoroughly enjoyed reading it.
In college, I studied East European and Slavic history. Naturally, I have been very interested in the Ukraine-Russia issue, especially the famous, or infamous, interview between Tucker Carlson and Vladimir Putin. In response to the circulating interview , as well as our reformed views on baptism, I have a question regarding the 988 “baptism of Russia.”
There are many stories and accounts written to explain why Prince Vladimir turned to Christianity. Regardless, Kievan Rus’ still became christianized as of that year. Knowing what we know now about baptism as an entrance into a covenant community, I was wondering what your thoughts were about that? Does being in the Orthodox Church preclude one from being received into the covenantal community of Christ? Also, what does the national baptism of Kievan Rus’ mean in terms of either Christian nationalism or national covenanting?
Thank you very much,

Olivia

Olivia, this is actually an enormous subject. If someone with that background were converted to Protestantism, and came to us, we would receive their baptism, and bring them into the church—in order to nurse their baptism back to health. As far as a national covenant goes, I believe that they are obligated to follow Christ in a heightened way, and because of all the false doctrines in the Russian Orthodox church, they are hampered in a heightened way. I believe they are in a terrible way.

Good Report

I thought I would share with you a small bit of the fruit of the work God has called you to on the internet. In part because of your faithfulness and insisting upon the authority of God’s word instead of going after all the “scientific” objections to the Biblical account of creation, I was—a bit over a year ago—convicted of my unbelief regarding Genesis 1-11 and brought to repentance. While I expect that, had you not been around (however meaningful a statement that is in light of God’s sovereignty), God would have used other means (and there were other means at play). Nevertheless, He did use your ministry to hammer the point home.
If you have the time and interest to go beyond this precis, I would invite you to read the testimony I gave to our Monday Night Evangelism team.
Yours in Christ, North of the 49th Parallel,

Calvin

Calvin, thanks very much and God bless.

Results May Vary

I’m in the OPC and desire to transfer my membership to the CREC. Lord willing this will happen. However, my pastor does not think the CREC is a true church. Would you know of any OPC ministers that would believe the CREC to be a true church?
Your brother in Christ,

Brandon

Brandon, we do have friends in the OPC, and we have folks there who are . . . not friends. But we have successfully transferred members both to and from the OPC. We have also been unsuccessful. Results may vary.

What to Do?

Our church recently came into a large sum of money (large for our small congregation, at least) for which we have no immediate need. I have suggested that a goodly portion of that money be set aside to aid congregants in the Christian education of their kids, whether that be in Christian school, classical Christian school, or homeschooling. The elders are amenable to this idea, but unsure of where to even begin. They have asked me to come in and speak with them about it (I teach in a Christian and classical school). Could you direct me to any resources about how to set up such a fund, how to vet applicants, and so on? Thank you for your time.

JDH

JDH, your best bet would be to contact ACCS. They have relationships with various financial advisors who are geared to help out classical Christian schools.

The Short Answer Is Yes

I give 10 percent to a church ministry, and I keep 10 percent for general giving. This month my parents asked for some financial help (about 20% of my earning), but it also just happens that this month I have a medical bill upcoming that requires me to keep all my savings as standby. In other words, I can’t dip into my savings or living expenses.
So, for this month, can I give my parents the 20% and not give the church ministry the 10% that I usually give?
Thanks,

P

P, given what Jesus teaches about honoring father and mother, and given that you are consistently giving 20% instead of 10%, and given that your parents are in need and the needy are a legitimate recipient of the tithe, I would say yes. Do it.

Good Idea

t seems the writing started with the magazine Credenda. Is there a book that has the articles, like an anthology?

Brent

Brent, not yet. Good idea.

Klavan Contact

Heard you on Klavan. Bless the man, he has a very Christ centric but loose theology. I’m curious what position your stance comes from as you threw out words like eschatology and reformed. Thanks.

Frank

Frank, this would be a good intro to what we are about.

Many Thanks

When I read about this on Twitter, I commented that this was mountains and molehills. I knew nothing of the debate or “controversy.” I just knew I trust Doug Wilson, which would be you! Since I embraced, shockingly, postmillennialism in Aug. 22, I’ve listened and read and learned a very lot from you. I also have a young friend, early 30s, who came to Christ in Moscow and loves everything about the environment. Plus I know of your children and some of their work, and you pass the Paul-Timothy test of a well-managed family.
Jesus said you will know the tree by its fruit, and I see nothing but good fruit from the Doug Wilson tree. Thanks for all you do. It’s insane how much that is, and it is an inspiration to all of us who have been influenced by it.

Mike

Mike, you are very kind. Thank you.

Yes. Be Careful

Re: Alistar Beggs Kerfuffle
What came to my mind immediately, I have not seen mentioned in the many written lines ( might have missed it), but it is simply this;
A song learned as a child . . . ”Be careful little eyes what you see . . . Be careful little eyes what you hear . . .” based on Proverbs 4: 23-27.
Does Grammy want to witness the physical intimacy between the grandson and the other person? That kiss, hug and handholding? Does she want to hear words of commitment to sin? All very hard to unsee and unhear. Would this cause her spiritual distress?
“ponder the path of thy feet . . .”

Nancy

Nancy, correct. Either you have the eewww reaction or you don’t, and both are a problem.

Now There’s An Idea

AI writes a CCM song. Might make an interesting Doug reacts video?

Steve

Steve, there you go. Keep the ideas coming.

Postmill Commentary

A post-mill commentary? I humbly suggest my commentary… Revelation: Kick at the Darkness Till it Bleeds Daylight. Self published & available on Amazon or for free at iamnarrative.com
Perhaps Canon would like to publish?

RC

RC, thanks.

The Looming Danger

In a recent plodcast on Machen, Doug mentioned that he didn’t think Owen Strachan’s recent book on wokeness hit the center of the issue. He then concluded that segment with the ominous line that “we are in more danger than that” or something similar. And then he just ends. I would love for Doug in either a blog post or another plodcast episode to expand on that final thought: say more about the nature and extent of the danger he to which he refers.
Thanks!

Jeff

Jeff, the long and short of it is that the false religion of liberalism in Machen’s day had a large amount of inherited capital to squander, which they then went and did. We are in the grip of similar pathologies, with virtually no capital to speak of. In other words, the prodigal will go straight from home to the pig food.
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Zeph
2 months ago

Jack, Linebarger has some nonfiction books on Project Gutenberg, if interested.

Andrew Lohr
Andrew Lohr
2 months ago
Reply to  Zeph

Theologian James B. Jordan has an article “Christianity and the science fiction of Cordwainer Smith.” I liked Smith’s short story “Scanners live in vain” and Wik says it’s his most anthologized (others like it too?)

Zeph
2 months ago
Reply to  Andrew Lohr

Required reading in my high school

Jeff
Jeff
2 months ago

I’d voice the alternate view to supporting those who are cohabiting. It seems that it is awfully close to ‘shall we then sin so God’s grace can abound?’

Mike Freeman
Mike Freeman
2 months ago
Reply to  Jeff

I received an interesting bit of spam in my inbox titled 25 Boomer Skills That Are Now Useless. The first one on the list was getting married. The article argued that these days, fewer and fewer people are getting married, more and more children are being born out of wedlock, people are engaging in serial monogamy, and the nuclear family is largely a thing of the past. So, according to the article, marriage is, or is fast becoming, an obsolete skill. Someone even made the joke that if present trends continue, gay people will be the only people who still… Read more »

Jill Smith
Jill Smith
2 months ago
Reply to  Mike Freeman

The Catholic position used to be that one of them had to move out until after the couple had taken the compulsory marriage preparation classes and were actually married. But, while some priests still insist on that, most are only too happy that the couple are finally tying the knot. It’s said that up to 60% of couples wanting a Catholic wedding are already living together.

John Middleton
John Middleton
2 months ago
Reply to  Jill Smith

I’d go with the Catholic used-to-be position, but I also lean in the direction of everything we can do to encourage, rather than discourage, marriage. I’d worry little about marriage preparation classes as I doubt they are going to teach the couple much they don’t already know or do much good. Just stop doing what you’re doing and then do what you should have done as soon as you can.

Jeff
Jeff
2 months ago
Reply to  Mike Freeman

There was a lot of handwringing over what A Begg said. But don’t sexual immorality and fornication appear in the big list of sins which exclude one from the kingdom?

I believe if the Church cannot start here we’ll never get anywhere regarding the culture’s sexual chaos.

And it has been my experience that many pastors will marry cohabiting couples for various reasons, Doug’s being one of them. And despite the many helpful things he does, I believe he is in error on this.

John Middleton
John Middleton
2 months ago
Reply to  Mike Freeman

I started to say “No it’s still something we care about”, but then I thought, “I dunno, I don’t hear as much about it as I used to”. Might just be because I’m older and long married, and not close to circles where it is personally applicable. I do think by far most evangelicals would still tell you it is wrong.

Alex
Alex
2 months ago
Reply to  Mike Freeman

Cohabitating couple at my church years ago left after facing threat of discipline. They just went to another church in town, where the guy had family in attendance. Pastor there welcomed them and didn’t want to cause a stir with the family. At least for southern rural areas, I’d guess that’s the norm.

Mike Freeman
Mike Freeman
2 months ago
Reply to  Alex

The other question is how much longer will the churches that continue to discipline for sexual immorality continue to do so, given that they’re swimming upstream against the culture. I will right now make a prediction that within the next twenty years, almost all evangelical churches will be welcoming of not just cohabiting couples but gay couples too.

Ken B
Ken B
2 months ago
Reply to  Mike Freeman

I don’t think there will be any evangelical churches welcoming cohabiting or gay couples for the simple reason if they do so they will cease to be evangelical churches.

Cherrera
Cherrera
2 months ago
Reply to  Ken B

Bingo. Just become Unitarian Universalists or call it “Sunday Morning DEI Training” if you go that route. Whatever it is, it’s not a Christian church.

Ken B
Ken B
2 months ago
Reply to  Mike Freeman

The late David Pawson who had an itinerant ministry in Britain for years and was very clued up on the actual spiritual state of the church commented he never went into an evangelical church in the UK where sexual sin wasn’t known about but nothing done about it. Not just the youth group but adultery and remarriage. He spent years warning against complacency that you can live like that and still have an assurance of salvation. I well remember a couple who came round wanting to talk about God and Jesus having been worked on by a mutual friend. They… Read more »

Mike Freeman
Mike Freeman
2 months ago
Reply to  Ken B

I don’t disagree with you. That said, when I was growing up — back in the days when dinosaurs still roamed the earth — getting a divorce and then remarrying would get you excommunicated. We were not allowed to play with children whose parents were divorced. Today, the percentage of evangelicals on their second or third marriage probably mirrors the general population. A lot of churches have divorce support groups. Absolutely no one is disciplined for it any more, and it’s not even a bar to ministry in many churches. When I was growing up, I would have said the… Read more »

Jane
Jane
2 months ago
Reply to  Jeff

They’re not supporting the cohabitation. They’re supporting marriage.

James
James
2 months ago
Reply to  Jeff

Once they’re married, they can’t sin together anymore

Jennifer Mugrage
2 months ago

Was looking forward, with some trepidation, to the letter on pregnancy and fat. Totally confused by the letter that actually appeared under that heading.

JSM
JSM
2 months ago

Indeed, I read the question and response a couple of times to make sure I didn’t miss anything.

john k
john k
2 months ago

The title is likely a misprint. Perhaps it was meant to be “Pregnancy amd Faith.” The Watts is a paraphrase of Isaiah 49:15.