Arms Full of Justice Swag

In light of the recent events in Baltimore, everyone wants to have an honest conversation about race. The difficulty is that in this honest conversation about race, nobody is allowed to say anything that is true. We have gotten to the point where the simple truth is inflammatory. Now the obvious truth should be about as inflammatory as a CVS pharmacy, but unfortunately, the logic of that observation is now officially running in the wrong direction.

So allow me, if you will, to say some things that I believe to both true and relevant. Here are seven observations related to race relations and public order.Baltimore Gift Cards

1. Some of my compatriots on the pasty end of the color spectrum start to panic whenever I write about race. They believe that I am not helping, and that whatever I have to say will be detrimental to race relations within the body of Christ. But the black brothers in Christ that I count as friends don’t feel the same way. They are not obligated to believe what I say, but I do want them to feel an obligation to believe that I am saying nothing other than what I believe to be true — and that that is the only reason I am saying it. Too many trendy evangelicals, if politically correct sentiments were water, act like those long-range lawn sprinklers, the ones that have a 360 degree reach. When my black friends read what I say, they know that I believe what I am saying. When a pale fellow, pale both ways, gives them various Jesified CNN talking points, they are never sure. So if you really want an honest conversation about race, stop saying what you are expected to say, and start saying what you actually think. That’s what honesty means, incidentally.

2. The inner-city pathologies that are on display in Baltimore right now are religious and cultural, not genetic or racial. We are observing one more failure of socialism, and not the failure of black people. As Iowahawk put it yesterday, in a magnificent observation, “In 1959, Detroit was the wealthiest city in America and Cuba was the wealthiest country in Latin America. #HappyMayDay” If you want to get the same pathologies we are seeing here, only with white people, that is perfectly possible. We have the technology. I recommend Theodore Dalrymple’s Life at the Bottom if you are up for a real eye-opener. The Baltimore riots do invite judgment, but make sure you triple-check the identity of the defendant. The defendant is leftism.

3. Scripture says that the sins of some men go before them, and others come behind. “Some men’s sins are open beforehand, going before to judgment; and some men they follow after” (1 Tim. 5:24). As it happens, when a black idiot runs out of a store with his arms full of justice swag, his sin goes before him. When a white idiot, ensconced in his think tank at Harvard, proposes that we make everyone healthy, wealthy, and wise by federal fiat, his sin comes behind him. Some men carry their sin in front of them like a shield, and others drag it behind them, like a rope. With some men we see the consequences of the sin right away. With others, we don’t see it for a good seventy-five years, and even then there is debate among the learned. So Baltimore is not what happens when blacks govern themselves. Baltimore is what happens when anybody governs according to the pious platitudes of the whitest people in New England.

4. If cops murdered Freddie Gray, and if the sufficient evidence is discoverable, then of course those cops should be charged, convicted, and punished. But whether any such evidence is extent will not be determined by how many bags of Doritos you manage to carry away from a burning store. When it comes to the administration of justice, mobs on the streets are, um, rarely helpful.

5. If there was a rush to indict these six cops in order to restore order, that means there will be the same kind of pressure to convict, in order to prevent Baltimore going up in a sheet of flame. You have created a circumstance where issues other than simple innocence or guilt are affecting what is going on in the courtroom. That is a terrible situation to be in. But at the same time, if there was a rush to indict, then the chances are also increased that the assembled cases were hurried and sloppy, and there may well be charges dropped later, or acquittals. When that happens — well, as we used to say in the Navy, stand by for heavy rolls.

6. When people live under a despotic tyranny, it is not surprising when they finally get to a breaking point. But that is not what this is. If this really were a “we’re not going to take it anymore” moment, the mobs would be attacking police stations and city hall. The fact that they are attacking innocent merchants is damning. What it means is that the rioters of Baltimore are publicly saying that in order to ruin somebody’s life in this city, you need have no due process at all. You do not need evidence, you do not need a trial, you do not need justice. All you need is a grievance. But once you adopt that as your categorical imperative — so behave that you are willing for your behavior to become a universal law — you discover that the cops are allowed, under your new universal law, to have a grievance against men like Freddie Gray.

In short, the cops in this case might have a contempt for the demands of justice. The looters — sorry, undocumented shoppers — definitely have a contempt for the demands of justice. They are thus, demonstrably, the last people in the world we should listen to. They have voted for exactly the kind of government they claim they live under.

7. I mentioned inner city pathologies earlier. The central pathology there is fatherlessness. That pathology exists because progressive governments have declared war on fatherhood. They hate it, but when they have succeeded in virtually exterminating it, they find that a lot more police work is necessary. But you can’t hire enough cops to contain a nation of fatherless men.

If you want flourishing cities, then there are two things that are necessary, two places to begin. You have to stop paying single moms to refuse to marry the fathers of their children, and you have to stop chasing jobs for those fathers out of the city with your regulations, taxes, rules, social engineering, and all-around fussy whiteness — because, let us be frank, your officious willingness to mess around with other people’s lives is whiter than Woodrow Wilson’s thighs.

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holmegm
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holmegm

What strikes me is the utter blindness of one side of this. The self-proclaimed science-worshipers’ utter unwillingness to look at the, you know, facts. Baltimore is, and has been for a long time, run by Democrats and blacks. The Left runs the city, and the city runs the cops. If the cops are messed up, and you are looking for who to blame, you shouldn’t have to look very hard. White Republicans have about as much to do with the pathology of Baltimore as green Martians do. If there is any societal blame to be hung for this, there is… Read more »

Eric the Red
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Eric the Red

I would find Doug’s argument, and holmegm’s comment, far more persuasive if we didn’t have a long history of fairly consistent racial unrest during times when there was far less leftist policy than there is now. When Rodney King’s attackers were acquitted in 1992, there was a race riot. In the 1960s, there were race riots in several American cities. And of course there was all the racial violence staged by whites against blacks for over a century — lynch mobs, the racial violence aboard Navy ships when they were integrated, the repeated torching of black communities in the South… Read more »

paulm01
Member

Since when is base bad behavior historical racism? Maybe I should look at my ethnic history and start getting mad for ancestral mistreatment from centuries prior then go steal a goat from my neighbor or burn his barn down. But that would be a specious argument and intellectually dishonest. Where is the grace towards others in that? Yes of course there has been racism in our history, and some today. It’s horrible and wrong. But those perpetrators of such hatred will be harshly judged by the great I Am when the time comes. Rioters, regardless of race or political bent… Read more »

Eric the Red
Guest
Eric the Red

Paul, I haven’t said a single word in defense of the rioters. Not one. It is possible to both deplore racism and also acknowledge that that does not justify looting a CVS.

My point, rather, is that if you’re looking to assign blame, I think Doug is looking in the wrong place. We’ve always had racial unrest in this country, no matter who is making policy. Blaming liberals for it now makes no more sense than blaming conservatives for it in the 1950s.

paulm01
Member

Didn’t suggest you did. When people do not have Christ in their hearts this is what happens…and all the societal formula’s, machinations, or mental gymnastics will never solve it, only God can do that through His Son. Doug is correct…this is not a race thing it’s a Scriptural thing. I would add it’s a Scriptural thing catalyzed through “race” wrapped up in a load of historical justification by those who constantly carry the bad water bucket forward for their own gain…which is the same stuff I fork out of the horse stall every morning. You’d think “we’d” know better by… Read more »

dchammers
Member

But I think we can blame conservatives in the 1950’s.

holmegm
Guest
holmegm

Does Baltimore run its own police department, or not?

Is Baltimore run by black Democrats, or not? Are they the ones you are charging with racism? If not, are you saying that this ye olde white racism is so powerful that it took over their minds and bodies, scifi style?

(Obligatory: yes, racism is always wrong. Nobody was saying that it wasn’t. I too, am for good things and against bad things. Which has nothing to do with anything we are talking about.)

Eric the Red
Guest
Eric the Red

Holmegm, see my response to David below.

timothy
Guest
timothy

Victims of slavery and Jim Crow are either dead or nearing their dotage. Those youths have known nothing but progressive policies: abortion on demand, divorce, public education, television, rap music, etc. It is their culture. Yes, they built it. Two tips. 1. White guilt doesn’t fly anymore. 2. The groundwork is being laid by progressives to return to racism as a policy because science. (google, “ny times genetic basis race”) Ok, three tips. 3. This is what rejection of God does to a culture. It is called Christian civilization–you know the best evah in the history of mankind–because of Christ.… Read more »

David R
Guest
David R

Eric, your examples bolster Wilson’s and holmegm’s point. Who was it that was wearing the white hoods and torching black communities? Who was it that was implementing Jim Crow laws? Who was it that were lynching black men? Whose party slogan was “This is a white man’s country: Let white men rule.” ? Democrats. Everywhere where these riots happened, whether they were in the 60’s or in Baltimore, who was in control of those cities? Democrats. Look at all the cities that are in ruin, where crime is rampant, where hope is lost, and ask yourself who runs those cities?… Read more »

Eric the Red
Guest
Eric the Red

Yes, David, at one time the Democratic party was the party of Southern racism. That was then, this is now. Once the Democratic Party became the party of civil rights, the racists all started voting Republican. That was Nixon’s Southern strategy, you may recall. In those days, though, the Democratic Party was pretty conservative, and times have changed. And the common thread you’re trying to draw is seriously deficient. A lot of those cities were industrial cities that lost their financial base when major corporations started sending jobs overseas, which they were able to do because of deregulation and free… Read more »

holmegm
Guest
holmegm

Oh, it’s lack of jobs.

Your theory explains the massive crime wave during the Great Depression. Oh wait …

Eric the Red
Guest
Eric the Red

Crime did go up during the Great Depression; check the numbers.

David R
Guest
David R

“the racists all started voting Republican” This is simply not true. All the Dixiecrats remained Democrats, except one, Strom Thurmond. The South voted voted Democratic for quite some time after desegregation. The South voting patterns changed over time, but only on the federal level (Senators and President). They eventually voted consistently Republican at the national level, but locally they were firmly democratic up until 2012. My state of North Carolina was run by Democrats for 100 years up until 2012 when the Republicans gained the House, Senate, and Governorship for the first time in a century. When Bill Clinton was… Read more »

Eric the Red
Guest
Eric the Red

The Dixiecrats who were already in office mostly stayed Democrat, but as they died or retired they were mostly replaced by Republicans with the same views that the Dixiecrats once held. And as far as the South voting Democrat after desegregation, recheck those numbers. George Wallace as an independent carried the South in 1968. Nixon carried it in 1972. Jimmy Carter carried it in 1976, but the fact that he was a Southerner probably carried some weight, and wasn’t enough for him to carry it in 1980. Reagan carried it in 1980 and 1984, and Bush carried it in 1988.… Read more »

Tom
Guest
Tom

The problem with this thesis, leaving aside the question of its veracity, is that the old-line segregationists are, mostly, dead or senile. By now, desegregation is largely irrelevant to Southern conservative views of the Democratic and Republican parties, except insofar as it relates to views on centralized government power.
Had the Democrats not endorsed Roe v. Wade wholeheartedly, then jumped on the gay marriage bandwagon, it is entirely possible–no, probable–that the South would not be solid for the Republican party.

Nathan S
Guest
Nathan S

These discussions go just as far as they need to in order to condemn the easiest villain. For the left, it’s the cops and the Republicans. For the right, it’s socialism and the Democrats. Both plays are cheap, and false.

I say, start with an honest discussion of what specific people and groups of people did, and back it up with documentation. Most of the general discussion about this issue evaporates with that simple rule.

https://www.themarshallproject.org/2015/04/29/david-simon-on-baltimore-s-anguish

Nathan S
Guest
Nathan S

Apologies, I meant to post this article as well – my computer isn’t exactly stellar.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/04/28/what-you-really-need-to-know-about-baltimore-from-a-reporter-who-lived-there-for-30-years/

Blame placed on racism, or socialism, or White People in Berkeley Conducting Social Experiments, et. al, really misses the mark. Any true placing of blame will condemn hundreds, from the top down, on all sides. Anything less is pandering.

timpaul
Guest
timpaul

Eric, we’re all slaves, don’t you know? The universe has this ethical, innate, no neutrality component. So, who are you going to be a slave to? ” It may be the devil or it may be the Lord but you’re gonna have to serve somebody.”
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&q=serve%20somebody%20dylan%20youtube%20alp%20motorcycle&ei=pOJFVZKBEpa3ogTX_4GQCA&url=http://m.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DgC3cvaZV6mI&ved=0CBwQtwIwAA&usg=AFQjCNHxjh0GmmShPlD5f0T_2gENCHkx1A&sig2=u49BrO1h3_3roqM2gm-CXw

timpaul
Guest
timpaul

So Blog and Mablog now censors? It’s a brave new world beginning in Moscow.

timpaul
Guest
timpaul

Well, it seems if a video link of motorcycles racing up the Swiss Alps in tune to Bob Dylan’s “Serve Somebody” is provided, Verboten happens

timothy
Guest
timothy

I have had problems posting links too. I have contacted the administrator.

When I have posted with a link, the comment shows as ‘awaiting moderation’.

My guess is that things are still shaking out from the blog switchover.

cheers.

t

Eric the Red
Guest
Eric the Red

I had one comment that didn’t clear; on the thread about the baker, I posted a link to a recent decision by a Kentucky court that a print shop could not be required to print gay pride materials that violated their Christian conscience.

Barnabas
Guest
Barnabas

In 2015 America, racism serves a Marxist motivating myth. If racism is defined as favoring the good of your race over the good of another race then white Americans in2015 are probably the least racist population that has ever existed. At the same time, Marxist control over the narrative has gotten so strong that even Church leaders have to piously mumble about the scourge of racism all around us. We are in a situation where grievance is being multiplied to produce a discontented proletariat and the more society tries to appease them the more outlandish the demands become. Blacks have… Read more »

LB
Guest
LB

You guys really need to get rid of the “Wordsmithy” ads that show up when you post these to Facebook. People pass over the article because they think it is an advertisement for a book!

Barnabas
Guest
Barnabas

Human genetics certainly play a role in black underclass class and in the underclass in general. Social pathology depends a great deal on low IQ and impulsivity. Even if there weren’t differences in those traits between races (and there are well documented differences) there is a strong skimming effect created by the modern economy. People with higher IQ and lower impulsivity leave the geographic area and social circle of the underclass. You can witness this, as I have, in the black inner city, white Appalachia, or rural Latin America. Smart people leave; dumb people stay and have children with other… Read more »

timothy
Guest
timothy

I am currently on year three of a multi-year sabbatical in Appalachia. The difference in I.Q is readily apparent when contrasted with the high I.Q environment I used to frequent. High I.Q without Christ is dead. There are other things up here that my home lacks (yet had, when I was growing up) Very strong family bonds. The happiness between parent and child and grand-parent-child, especially among the poorest, is blindingly evident. People marry early and the community is there for the family. Polite civil sphere where a ‘you doing alright?’ is the frequent greeting among strangers. Christ is here;… Read more »

paulm01
Member

Love it!

…and the meek shall inherit the Kingdom.

TBH
Guest
TBH

Sirs Barnabas and Timothy- Your comments and assumptions may say more about your I.Q. than those you choose to stereotype. As a former native of a particular community located in the vast area which you call “Appalachia,” your assumptions are arrogant at best. Your first mistake is assuming that an area that exists in parts of 12 states comprising of 25 million people can be described in such generalizations. Perhaps it is a lack of exposure to various cultures within the range of mountains known as the Appalachians, but it is none the less an ignorant assumption. Oh yes, and… Read more »

timothy
Guest
timothy

Ok, TBH. Enlighten us. What is your point? My comment was on how I.Q is irrelevant when discussing our relationships with each other as Christians; to Him, we are all dust. His ways are higher than our ways and His thoughts are higher than our thoughts. The smartest person in the universe is nothing before God almighty. God is no respecter of persons; read God’s extended answer to Job for His opinion on our opinions. By God’s grace I live among wonderful people who are in possession of a gift of His love and it shows! What on God’s green… Read more »

TBH
Guest
TBH

Timothy, I don’t disagree with much you have said with the exception of your first comment that appears to complement Barnabas’ view of social pathology and its link to IQ among “white Appalachia.” You appear to agree with him in part on the IQ piece. That is an easy target that doesn’t normally doesn’t catch the heat that other “people groups/races’ catch when referenced. The entire comment by Barney was egregious pertaining to cultural migrations and I think an exaggeration of facts. He took one too many liberties with Doug’s invitation to be political incorrect here.

timothy
Guest
timothy

Hi TBH,

Thank you for clarifying.

Job
Guest
Job

Yep. Christ died for the left half of the bell curve too.

BJ
Guest
BJ

As an Appalachian-American (born in southern Ohio to a family half of whom were Kentucky born), I can assure you that your comparison of the inner city chaos to white Appalachia is off base. There is no doubt we have our fair share of dumb folks, but let’s not confuse traditional values for intelligence. I know many folks in my family and otherwise who chose to stay even though they could have gone to major urban areas nearby to make a lot more money or pursue a more prestigious career, because they valued close family ties and friendships more than… Read more »

Barnabas
Guest
Barnabas

I had a comment that didn’t clear. Pathology in the white rurals is not as severe as the inner city both because of founder effect and because the skimming is not as aggressive as you would find in dangerous inner city projects. (Less pathological culture as well but that culture is crumbling.) I might offer objective evidence as that presented in Charles Murray’s Coming Apart or anecdotal from my and my wife’s families. Gen Xrs or Millennials who moved to urban areas are wealthier, slimmer, smoke less and use less drugs, are more likely to be married and more likely… Read more »

BJ
Guest
BJ

Barnabas, I certainly do not deny that the ills you mention are prevalent in rural Appalachian country. I might question the extent to which they exist, but there are two fundamental differences between the pathologies of white rural America and mixed inner city America. (1) Many many people in rural America are much more self sufficient then their counterparts in the inner city. They are much more likely to have built their own home or are at least capable of maintaining it as well as their car. Whereas the urbanites you mention are almost totally dependent upon others to maintain… Read more »

Barnabas
Guest
Barnabas

Reading Charles Murray will give you all the stats on the white underclass. They are still better off than the black underclass but are falling fast. I’m not sure how much he distinguishes between rural and urban or suburban whites.

timothy
Guest
timothy

Hi Barnabas,

There are pockets of meth-heads and the consequent evils withing 30 miles of me. I do not blame I.Q or “whitey” (heh) for the problem.

FWIW, I read a blurb that stated that the Scots once evangelized the world, but are now reduced to welfare dependency.

BJ
Guest
BJ

Thank you, Barnabas. I will look into it.

Barnabas
Guest
Barnabas

Murray and RR Reno do a good job in showing how the radical moral libertarianism of the left is destroying the working class. To the extent that white rurals have avoided this its in how much they have failed to embrace that libertine lifestyle. The underclass is living out the social marxist dystopia while upper class leftists have, for the most part, refused to get high on their own supply.

PB
Guest
PB

BJ, your points are only partially accurate. I would have agreed with you 10-15 years ago, but I think the differences you point out, although still present, are having less and less effect on how they are expressed in rural culture. The safety net has extended beyond the city limits and is now a very present part or these rural communities. The newest and nicest structure in my small rural area is the Social Services building, and the only long line in town is found at the local church’s food pantry. Government assistance is destroying rural America’s family structure the… Read more »

BJ
Guest
BJ

PB, I am not going to wholeheartedly disagree with you at all. It has been my experience that you are correct about women more and more becoming the breadwinners in rural America. Families in the lower classes of rural America are also very much in shambles, no question. And the causes are complicated. No amount of mechanical know-how will get someone off drugs, but there are still significant differences between the rural poor and the urban poor. The most significant difference is that the urban poor can hide among the crowds and are able to find handouts from the more… Read more »

PB
Guest
PB

From what I see here, there is a residual encouragement towards responsibility but I would attribute it more to the remaining influence (internally) of the Christian church than to social pressures. The memory of strong families, Christian values, and a hard work work ethic is not so far removed that it no longer influences the thinking of the poor. I would imagine that a very large majority of the local population identifies as Christian, and see themselves as just having fallen on hard times, rather than having been purposefully positioned by society into inescapable poverty. The entitlement mentality is not… Read more »

BJ
Guest
BJ

I think you more or less quite right about it. I do agree that the ills of urban America are seeping through to Appalachia. Let’s pray that Christ will redeem city and suburb and town, alike. Blessings.

Under His Mercy,
BJ

TBH
Guest
TBH

Please note my comment to you and Timothy below.

Barnabas
Guest
Barnabas

I’m not trying to dehumanize anybody, quite the opposite. What I’m saying is that some were born with the ability to pick fruit, others to solder circuit boards, others to teach economics. I think that to the extent that fruit needs to be picked, circuit boards soldered, or college courses taught, we need to see that Americans are the ones doing it. Importing cheap labor and outsourcing jobs while saying “hey, just get an education and take your place in the knowledge economy” is foolish.

kentwarrenmcdonald
Member

Thanks for another insightful screed and enjoyable read. Humor laced with honesty is the best kind. There will always be naysayers who don’t like the truth spoken during the daylight hours. Their preferred environment includes mumbling expletives under the breath, in the dark. Truth, like the Gospel, is difficult to hear and understand unless your heart has been changed by God.

Barnabas
Guest
Barnabas

White Americans in 2015 are among the least tribalist (racist) populations that have ever existed. Anyone who argues otherwise is disingenuous. Racism is currently serving as what Sorel would have described as a motivating social myth which is constructed to arouse the masses to revolutionary action. This myth is not rational and is not mean to be but is meant to provoke the proletariat to overthrow the existing system. Riots are a feature and not a bug of the Marxist narrative. Blacks are being encouraged to disassimilate themselves from American culture. Twenty years ago middle class blacks could acknowledge the… Read more »

timpaul
Guest
timpaul

Doug, yes. Maybe a little glitch.

timpaul
Guest
timpaul

It was just a response to Eric that we are all slaves, unto righteousness or sin. Hence the Dylan link regarding,” you’re gonna have to serve somebody…It may be the devil or it may be the Lord but you’re gonna have to serve somebody.”

No Holds Barred
Guest
No Holds Barred

I think this viewpoint leaves out the reason that Detroit and Baltimore once attracted African Americans and immigrants from around the world – manufacturing jobs. These jobs are gone and are not coming back. It’s not just a leftest plot. The question is how do we take noncompetitive groups of people of different races throughout the USA make them competitive in an higher education driven economy. It would be great to see the family as one of the corner stones of reform, but the left is not done destroying the institution of marriage and they will do everything possible to… Read more »

paulm01
Member

So true…most of those jobs were destroyed by the very unions that supposedly protected the working class man (regardless of race.)…they got greedy and killed the Golden Goose. And most unions vote Democrat, instructing their constituents to do the same or else.

By the way, the trades are sorely lacking. Wanna make good money? Become a plumber or electrician or diesel mechanic.

Moor_the_Merrier
Guest
Moor_the_Merrier

TBH, defender against white on white racism, condemner of egregious claims, prophet of the blogosphere.

Thank God for people like you who won’t tolerate one liberty too many!

TBH
Guest
TBH

Glad to be of service.

katie
Guest
katie

Surely this is just another example of the sexual rebellion against God that has been discussed in regards to homosexuality. Fornication seems to have landed Baltimore (as one example) in a world with no fathers, and a world with no fathers seems to be populated by rootless, lawless young men trying to emulate manly strength by its very opposite – a striving for power through violence and through money (via the the drug trade that is plaguing Baltimore’s roughest neighborhoods).

jeers1215
Guest
jeers1215

You might just as well blame the slutty mothers: We’re left with a Baltimore filled with whorish women. Maybe the men wouldn’t be driven to such extreme lengths to obtain power if the women they needed to dominate weren’t so competitive.

The true culprit is Feminism 1.0 and the legal prohibition against marital spanking. If black men could discipline their women, I’m confident marital commitment would abound, and society would florish. But nope.

timothy
Guest
timothy

Please share your reasoning from Scripture supporting your comment;

jeers1215
Guest
jeers1215

Timothy,
Please share your reasoning from Scripture to enact violence against men that attempt to rule over women in nonsymbolic ways.

timothy
Guest
timothy

I will address your comment after you address my request; share your reasoning from Scripture supporting your comment.

Are you capable of doing so? If yes, please do. If not, state so forthrightly.

jeers1215
Guest
jeers1215

Timothy,
If you seek an answer to your question, you must show more enthusiasm.
And your reasoning from Scripture.

timothy
Guest
timothy

No, it is you who made the initial assertion and you who decorum compels to back up your claim; it is the Christian thing to do. You are a Christian aren’t you? Speak honestly and forthrightly.

valerieab
Member

Marital spanking is in no way, shape, or form condoned by Scripture. The rod is for children (Prov. 22:15) and fools (Prov. 26:3). A woman is not a child. If she is a fool, a) her father was probably missing/neglectful/abusive, and b) only a foolish man would marry her in the first place, so the fault lies just as much or more at the feet of men. Whiny boys who blame such problems on women are contemptible.

jeers1215
Guest
jeers1215

Valerie,
I’m not sure that you can understand.
I’ll try again anyway: Whiny girls who blame such problems on men are ugly.

valerieab
Member

Haha! Nope, not whiny, just biblical…something you haven’t yet tried to be. Blaming the woman is literally the oldest excuse in the book: “The woman you gave me…” (Gen. 3:12). Being a man means gladly accepting sacrificial responsibility, not pointing the finger at other people’s failures. The Second Adam shows us how it’s done: He takes the stripes His wayward bride deserves (Isaiah 53:5). He cherishes and beautifies her. That’s what biblical masculinity looks like, not your fifty shades of Islam.

valerieab
Member

[Comment posted yesterday never made it. Let’s try again.] Whiny? Nope. Biblical? Yep. Blaming women is literally the oldest excuse in the book: “The woman you gave me…” (Gen. 3:12). Masculinity is all about responsibility (search this site for glad assumption of responsibility for more on that), and the failure of the first man to take it is deeply entangled in the first sin that brought death to all humanity. Male laziness is deadly. But Jesus, in displaying true and perfect masculinity, saves us from that death. He takes responsibility for His bride, receiving the stripes that she deserves (Isaiah… Read more »

Barnabas
Guest
Barnabas

You fail to account for a situation where a woman is indeed a fool. That she should go without correction does her no favors. If she is to corrected, presumably her husband has her best interests at heart more so than the state.

valerieab
Member

My pointing to Jesus as the model of husbandry takes that situation into account. It assumes it, in fact. But it shows HOW the husband is to lead the wife out of foolishness — by responsibly taking the blows on himself, by laying down his life to sanctify her. The Father uses the rod to sanctify us as His children, but the Son never uses the rod to sanctify us as His bride. The King rules the nations with a rod of iron (Revelation 2:27, 12:5, 19:15), but never uses it on His bride. A merely human husband does not… Read more »

Barnabas
Guest
Barnabas

Pseudospiritual BS. I’ll take that to mean that a female fool may not be corrected, a popular opinion.

Barnabas
Guest
Barnabas

The scriptures dealing with fools are in Proverbs not Revelation.

valerieab
Member

Barnajeers, I would suggest you pursue a remedial course in reading comprehension.

katie
Guest
katie

1st: Ew. 2nd: I “blamed” fornication, which involves both men and women. Your comment doesn’t seem to contribute anything further, except for (see 1).

timothy
Guest
timothy

Heh.

At first glance I was trying to figure out which book of the old testament was abbreviated “1 Ew”..

(:

cheers.

t

katie
Guest
katie

That book was written by the little known apocryphal prophet jeers1215.

jeers1215
Guest
jeers1215

Katie,
You sound like a very thoughtful young woman.
(Sorry that spanking grosses you out)

Tom
Guest
Tom

Let me engage you seriously. Your first paragraph flies in the face of nearly all behavioral studies, the teaching of Scripture, and basic human decency and self-control. At the point where you claim that the men are driven to crime because the women are…something or other…one can claim that the women are promiscuous because they think they need to be to get a man. That statement, by the way, is less asinine than yours is. Your second paragraph does the same thing. Denial of legal rights to women, while it would decrease the divorce rate, would increase the number of… Read more »

jeers1215
Guest
jeers1215

Dear Tom,
You successfully used the word “asinine” in a sentence, but I still can’t take you seriously.

Tom
Guest
Tom

Good. If you did I would be concerned for my mental health.

Jane Dunsworth
Guest
Jane Dunsworth

oh look it’s a troll.

valerieab
Member

You can be assured that Jane has contempt for you when she doesn’t even bother to use proper capitalization and punctuation in dismissing you.

timothy
Guest
timothy

Oh my! Jane is an English teacher? (shudders)

Jill Smith
Member
Jill Smith

I too. I expect this site is crawling with them.

valerieab
Member

That’s what we get for allowing WiFi access under bridges.

valerieab
Member

Well, insofar as she’s a homeschooling mom, yes, but otherwise, no, she’s just a lady who knows her way around the English language as well as she does around Scripture and plain reason. Ye need not tremble lest ye be an enemy of those. ;^)

~Valerie, President of the Jane Dunsworth Fan Club

Jane Dunsworth
Guest
Jane Dunsworth

LOL, now I know where to come to get my ego stroked! But I’m not supposed to want that….

Jill Smith
Member
Jill Smith

I would be slithering away mortified under cover of darkness.

Jerrod Arnold
Guest
Jerrod Arnold

I hope you guys aren’t done discussing this. I was just beginning to think y’all were about to figure “me n mi peepal” out. ;-)

JohnC
Guest
JohnC

Yep – that’s the reality… No matter how hard you try – you won’t fill up the unfulfillment, longing, anger, lust, emptiness, greed, and envy with the promises of The Secular World… See – the lie the Secular World teaches is “This will make you whole.. This will make me fulfilled, joyful, and peaceful” And it won’t…. It can’t… That’s what we need to see in all this… That since the 1960’s – The Black Community is not FEELING better, more fulfilled, more whole, more justice, more peace, more joy…… But neither is ANY part of the Secular community –… Read more »

Steve
Guest
Steve

Don’t forget the minimum wage chasing jobs off as well. It’s a perfect storm between the awful government education, perverse welfare incentives, and minimum wage just to name a few. With poor education you get priced out of entry level jobs due to minimum wage. The few who bootstrap themselves (by God’s grace) out of welfare will deal with punishing taxes or stifling regulations.