Contents
Abortion Regret
Having been a woman in the same shoes with the same struggles of regret for 19 years now, it has been of major comfort to remember Revelations 12: 10, that Satan is the accuser and he will be thrown down. Yes, receive forgiveness from Christ once and be done with it, but on Sanctity of Life Sunday when that regret threatens to come creeping back and makes you wish you could vanish into the pew, the remembrance that it is not our Lord who accuses us any longer, but Satan. To tremble under his accusation is, as you said, unbelief. The article is already out there, so it won’t be adding anything through my comments, but to women who suffer from the same accusations of the past (or anyone whose sins haunt them, really), it is nice to remember that it really is ok to be mad at Satan and reminded that I no longer have to submit to him. The white witch really was justified in holding Edmund as a traitor, but after Aslan’s sacrifice, what deep treachery it was for her to pretend to still have a right to claim him.
I would love it if you spoke more about your thoughts on “resisting the devil” at some point. He’s oddly forgettable in modern sermons—not that he deserves airtime, but we do have an actual enemy to actually fight, hearing modern sermons can make it sound as if we’re only ever doing self improvement instead of building strength for his crushing defeat. Are we in wartime or not? We are!
Thanks for writing to this subject, it is a needed one.Mrs. Barr
Mrs. Barr, thank you very much.
Why Rome Did Well
Have you ever considered why the RC church condemned abortion from the beginning, while it took some time and struggle for Protestants? I have been wondering if it has to do with their view that the most godly woman in history achieved that sanctity through childbirth. Protestants seem to fear falling into the RC ditch of veneration. So we overreact by nearly ignoring Mary while making much of women like Deborah and Jael.John
John, I believe that it was because they had a long tradition of casuistry on life issues, e.g. contraception and such, and as such, it was not new territory for them. Protestants, at least in America, were confronted with a set of issues that were new to them.
Commentaries and Plagiarism
I have been struggling lately to understand the line between the faithful use of commentaries/outlines/sermons of great men of the past for my own sermon prep, and plagiarism. Now, I certainly never just copy word-for-word thoughts or phrases, but I will sometimes (if I really like the point they made) put the idea into “my own words” so that I can incorporate the idea in a sermon or lesson. I have done this in sermons here-and-there for about 2 years (I’m a young, and newly ordained Elder) w/o any trouble of the conscience . . . but there’s been lots of talk about plagiarism on X lately, and it started to make me wonder if I’ve ever crossed the line doing this method.
Because I’m so new in the ministry, I feel that I must rely pretty heavily on men of the past (and some contemporary pastors/theologians I admire) as I am just not at their level yet . . . but where is the line is “relying on them heavily” (meaning getting many thoughts from their work for my own sermons) and flat out plagiarism? Do sermons need to be completely novel writings? Where is the line between originality, while also staying within orthodoxy (that’s been covered for 2000 years) and not just coming up with “private interpretations” left and right? Thank you for your time.Anon Pastor
Anon Pastor, I think you should keep your rule of thumb pretty simple. If it is a standard sort of insight, common knowledge among those who know about it, simply put the thing into your own words. E.g. “Herod the Great was born around . . .” If it is a unique or striking insight, either with regard to content or the way it is phrased, give some acknowledgement that it is not your own. And I would put outlines in. the latter category, including AI outlines.
I recently watched an “Ask Doug” video featuring advice for new pastors. After being encouraged by the content, I am eager to receive advice as a bit more experienced pastor. How would you encourage a pastor to lead his church away from contemporary “praise and worship” music during the Lord’s Day gathering in favor of hymns and Psalms? Currently, the church enjoys (and expects) this contemporary form of music. Moving in a different direction will be difficult, but the pastors are convinced this is best for the church. Is this a transition you have led through? Any advice?CH
CH, yes. The way I would do it is by starting psalm sings in a parishioner’s home once a month, where you learn a psalm, and learn to sing it in four parts. I would start with some fuguing tunes, which seem imposing, but which are actually the easiest way to learn to sing parts. When you have been doing that for a year or so, somebody is going to ask, “Why couldn’t we do this Sunday morning?”
Brother Troubles
Hello. I hope this message finds you well. Better than I’m doing at least.
I don’t know if you remember my questions from years past. It’s been awhile since I’ve wrote in. I was certainly in a much more feminist frame of mind then, and I thank you for being so patient with me back when I thought you people (patriarchalists) were quite terrible. I’m sorry for that.
You were helpful, but even more so was a dear friend of mine, idk I’ll call him S. I thought he was a model husband who led his wife in love. I thought he was a model Christian who cared for the oppressed, the orphan and the widow. He was a brother to me in dark seasons of my life even before I liked him (I didn’t like many people at all back then). But he was insistently kind to me. The insistence seemed so very kind and pulled me out of suicidal self isolation. He was an older brother to me, a mentor. S and his wife were such dear friends and it would be difficult to overstate the impact they’ve had on my beliefs about God, myself and Christ’s body the Church.
Almost a month ago one of our close friends talked to our elders. She said five years ago, when she was a minor, a teenager, 18 years younger than S, he had inappropriate relations with her.
I don’t know all the details of what happened, or how many lines were crossed, but our church told him for the time being not to come and a police report was filed with multiple counts against him.
I guess, partly I’m writing because I’m scared. There are a lot of things I don’t know. I don’t know the specifics of the accusation, I don’t know if he’s repentant or if he thinks what he did was wrong, I’m not sure if what he did was wrong. My husband and I met with an elder last week. He thinks I was groomed also. I don’t know how much of what I’ve learned was true.
But I guess the question I have for you is what you think healthy, godly boundaries look like in the family of God. I have 4 brothers. I thought that (unless it went against their conscience) I should be able to treat my brothers in Christ like my brothers in blood. But my pastor says that it’s different. What do you think? And please are there any relevant verses I can study?Meredith
Meredith, I am very sorry for your plight. You are doing well by withholding judgment until you know for certain. But at the very least, you need to budget for the possibility that you were being groomed. Continue to wait on the Lord, and it sounds like your elders are pursuing this biblically. In the meantime, you are correct in coming to the conclusion that you cannot treat brothers in the Lord the same way you treat blood brothers. Take the simplest example. A close brother and sister both know that the relationship could never go anywhere else. But a close brother and sister in the Lord (unmarried) both know that the relationship could grow into something else. And that reality overshadows everything.
The Task of Song Selection
In Mother Kirk, you write that lyrics in public worship should be pastoral. Are you the selector of songs for public worship in Lord’s Day services? If not, did you train your music leader to understand and choose pastoral songs? Week to week, how do you pastor the church’s liturgy?
Peace,Charles
Charles, we have a music minister who makes the first draft of our music selections, keeping in mind the lexical readings for the service and the sermon topics. He draws up the selections for the coming month, and we then have a meeting of our ministers and music men to discuss and finalize it.
More Smashmouth
Re: Historical Backdrop to Smashmouth Incrementalism
Because 1968 comes before 1971, I’d say that the first major challenge to the Christian pro-life ethic was the Harvard Medical School’s redefinition of death in that year. Thirteen men decided that certain comatose people’s lives were a burden to themselves and others, and that redefining them as being “dead already” would have the utilitarian benefits of freeing up ICU beds and facilitating organ donation. Thus, “brain death” was invented out of thin air, without any tests, studies, or evidence that these people’s God-given spirits had actually departed.
What you said in reference to abortion, “Many evangelicals didn’t know what to think about it, and did not have a firmly established worldview that would enable them to reason their way to a pro-life conclusion,” continues to apply equally well to brain death, which has been foisted upon the public via a relentless propaganda campaign (“Give the gift of life!”) funded by our tax dollars.
After nearly 60 years of declaring neurologically disabled people to be “dead,” and profiting from their organs (in 2020 the transplant industry generated approximately $48 billion in revenue) there is still no evidence for brain death. The methods section of the latest American Academy of Neurology brain death guideline states that because of the lack of high-quality evidence on the subject, the guideline was determined by three rounds of anonymous voting.
A consistent pro-life ethic extends from the moment of fertilization until the separation of the spirit at natural death. “Brain dead” organ procurement is a concealed form of euthanasia.
For more information, our website, provides the information people need in order to make a fully informed decision about organ donation.Heidi
Heidi, thank you.
On the History of the Abortion Atrocity
Thanks for the background—really succinct and helpful.
I think I sense some disappointment in the SCOTUS ruling of Dobbs, in that it didn’t outlaw abortion at all but “washed its hands” of the matter by sending it back to the States. While a pessimistic view of Dobbs is understandable, I think it bears mentioning that Dobbs scratched Roe from the record, just as the 21st Amendment scratched the 18th. It reset reality to pre-1970s, freeing the States to go back to their originally scheduled programs, which some of them did.
Yes, it’s sad that there is even one State that permits these Molechian sacrifices, but I prefer to see Dobbs as part of a great reset more than a letdown. Our Federal government doesn’t have the Constitutional authority to make rulings on what comprises murder . . . for anyone. That is a State matter. Not all States treat murderers in the same way, or even define the “levels” of man-killing in the same way. While there are many, many similarities such that it might appear we’re all on the same page, there are plenty of incongruities between the States. As it should be. They are sovereign.
Yes, the battle is now broken into smaller pieces, but that is manageable, and victories will happen—victories we can point to, count, and rejoice in. We will have not fifty battles—they’re already won in many States—but several, where the ghouls are still in the majority. That’s as it should be, and it’s infinitely preferable to battling a monolithic Federal government that is way outside its lane, not only on abortion but also on a thousand other topics.
By God’s grace, we can save the children at the State level AND slay the Federal Leviathan.Andy
Andy, I agree with all of this. But if the worship of Molech gets entrenched in a sovereign state, “over there,” say, and they will not repent, we need a mechanism that would be the counterpart to secession—expulsion. That is because two cannot walk together unless they be agreed (Amos 3:3).
I enjoyed your piece on smash-mouth incrementalism. I am an avid follower or Abolitionist Rising and Mr. Russell Hunter. I watched your debate/discussion with him a few months ago.
Two questions . . .
1.) What is the biggest flaw in his argument?
2.) Please explain what penalties you believe should be applied to mothers who get abortions. Does it depend on whether they think the child is living? Think it’s a human? Have any external pressure/coercion?
Thanks!Caleb
Caleb, thanks for the questions, I believe the biggest vulnerability in the abolitionist position is the failure to recognize that every approach to this society-wide problem is incrementalist. If I support a heartbeat bill, I am not saying the child without a heartbeat deserves to die, any more than an abolitionist in Oklahoma who introduces an abolition bill there is saying that unborn children in Kansas deserve to die. Geographical incrementalism is not different than chronological incrementalism—provided the end goal is clear to both, which is the eradication of all human abortion.
The penalties for the mothers should be comparable to our penalties for murder generally. We distinguish between premeditated, malice aforethought, negligent homicide, manslaughter, etc. I think we should be careful to maintain such distinctions. For some mothers it would be first degree murder, and for others it could be much less (say heavy coercive pressure was being applied by parents).
The penalties for the mothers should be comparable to our penalties for murder generally. We distinguish between premeditated, malice aforethought, negligent homicide, manslaughter, etc. I think we should be careful to maintain such distinctions. For some mothers it would be first degree murder, and for others it could be much less (say heavy coercive pressure was being applied by parents).
Narrowing It Down
Ghastly Simplicity
I have noticed that you seem to be moving from “It’s Christ or Chaos,” to “It’s Christ.”
From your post: The future of America is Christian. We can say this in all confidence because the future of the world is Christian, and there is not a blessed thing that Klaus Schwab can do about it.
You may make a Postmillennialist out of me yet! Maranatha!David
David, thanks very much. Enjoy the trip.
Empathy Blues
RE: Empathy Blues
Doug, you really nailed it on the head with this one.
Sorry, someone had to say it.Jason
Jason, thanks for being that one!
Sounds Like a Mess
I’m 22 years-old, fresh out of college, pursuing a master’s and developing my startup. I am also losing my mind, and have been put, by circumstance and not by choice, in what is effectively a pastoral role I should not be performing for what few young men haven’t been devoured by the neutered chihuahuas in sheep’s clothing which makeup the majority of my fellow believers(?) at church. I do not know how to handle this, or navigate this in any way. I see two options before me; 1) accept the burning bush and try to follow a journey that I do not know how to embark on or 2) heed the biblical passages that remind me of my own ineptitude for this matter and step away from any church (as there are no alternatives).
The church I attend is a doctrinally weak, non-denominational, and consumed by gynocentrism. The elders lack wisdom, and what little wisdom they do possess, they do not share with the young. Rather, all sermons, teachings, preaching and speaking events are generic Christian rhetoric with no substance behind them. Unfortunately, I cannot switch churches, as there simply aren’t any others. I live in an EU country where my options are either Roman Catholics, Megachurches, Mormons or Jehovah’s Witnesses.
For further context, there is in fact a female elder who says she “sleeps around with other men, so she can preach the gospel to them as “pillow talk.”
Thankfully, not everyone here has the spiritual discernment of a cactus, and several young men and even some elders recognize how foolish things are. We are a minority, however, and the main issue is that out of all of us, even the elders, I am the one who possesses the most wisdom by a fair margin, despite being a Christian for less than two years and being only 22. I should be the one being mentored, instead I am the one mentoring lifelong Christians. I became a Christian by a road-of-Damascus-type conversion, and have self-taught doctrine (as my elders clearly weren’t going to) through the Internet, which is how I discovered your platform. I mention all this, not out of ego, but desperation, I do not have the answers, ability or the biblical qualifications required for this role. There are too many questions I do not know the answer to, and too much life experience I do not have. And yet, among my fellow churchgoers, the ones who aren’t corrupted see me as a pastor-in-making (despite attending no seminary or Bible-college, and many of them having done so), and the ones who dislike me (and there are no shortage as I do freely share whatever I’ve learned) would much rather I lose my ability to open my mouth.
In fact, I was even sabotaged recently. I was to deliver teaching to my youth group (scheduled months in advance), which was deemed too “discomforting” by certain feminist voices. As such my session was cancelled, and replaced with a generic rhetoric speaker. And, the culture sabotaged me as well. My business was denied investment because I was born the wrong race and sex (white male). All the investment options here require you to fill out a diversity form.
This letter has gone way too long, and there are so many details that could affect your response. So instead, I will pose a more generic question.
What is a young Christian man to do, when he barely has access to seven, let alone seven-thousand, who haven’t bent the knee to Baal? When his only source of mentoring is his own studies through the Internet, carrying all the risks of personal bias and personal sin with no means of external correction? And what happens when that same man is the only source of mentorship and authentic doctrine that other people, some new to the faith, some not, have?
Whenever I ask a difficult question to an elder, who’s job it would’ve been to guide me, the only response I get is “pray about it.” I have, a lot. They fail to recognize that it is their responsibility to be God’s chosen instrument to answer the prayers for wisdom that young men offer.
Best regards and I’m sorry to bother you with this,Victor
Victor, it sounds like quite the mess. While it is impossible to say anything on point from this distance, the thing that I would put at the head of the line (at least as something to pray about), is the idea of starting a home church. And while having to learn all the basics by yourself is no picnic, it can be done.
Marital Accountability
A younger, happily married, and quite lovely coworker of mine confessed recently that she is struggling with attraction to a (married) man we work with (an explicitly Christian business of significance in our community) and has asked me for advice and accountability.
The nature of her job is such that the two of them necessarily work together one morning a week (but very much in public) and must coordinate on quarterly events. It also occasionally makes a lot of sense for them to collaborate on some monthly projects, as doing the projects herself can easily take 10 times longer. I go to some length here to avoid revealing details, apologies, as I have no permission to share this openly.
The man has shown no interest in her, nor do either of us believe he knows of her attraction and struggle with that. But if he does not consider her to be an attractive woman, I would be shocked. I consider it likely to quite worsen everything were he to be aware of her temptations.
She has confessed to her husband, who seems to be handling it wisely and calmly, forgiving her and asking her to make some changes to their interactions. It seems to me that she has made the easy changes to avoid extra interactions with him, but further changes would require explanations to those in charge and might (in my view) dangerously spread this information. To my knowledge, only her, her husband, myself, and one other woman are aware of this.
So I have two questions for you.
First, am I right to advise her that it is more important that this does not become widely known than that she avoid the man? Oh, important addition is that they also attend the same mid-size church. Quitting the job (which would have large community cost in my view) would not get him out of her regular life.
Second, I have not spoken with her husband directly. If I did, I’m not even sure what I would have to say? But do you see value in comparing notes? I really don’t think my friend’s honesty is in question. She brought this to me, agreed to confess to her husband soon after, and was not in any way caught in it. But perhaps there is wisdom in meeting with them both to pray and discuss?
I ask because I worry not only about making too little of this temptation, but also about making too much of it. I want for her to mortify it and get over it. Too much attention to sin, well, I’m sure you know the risks.Anon
Anon, the thing that must be avoided is the sin of infidelity. After that, it is also important to guard against scandal (the widely-known part). The thing I would recommend is that you ask to meet with the husband and wife together, and you should simply ask the husband what he would like you to do, and then do that. And if she does not get to a place of victory in mortifying the temptation soon, the husband should see to it that she gets the necessary pastoral help.
Not a Good Idea
I was speaking with my pastor about a mutual friend, who is also a pastor and survivor of brain cancer. While in the pulpit one Sunday, he had a spell where he became confused and was not able to finish his sermon (this has happened before, but not in a pulpit). His wife helped him down from the pulpit and to a seat, then got up and finished the sermon for him. My pastor went on about how he felt this was a beautiful picture of Christian marriage and two people being united and of the same mind.
I feel very conflicted about this. Not just the scenario itself, which isn’t ideal, but I understand things happen and at that little church there really may not have been another man there who could’ve taken his place right then and there—but by my pastor’s admiration of this event. What are your thoughts?Kenneth
Kenneth, we can be grateful for the like-mindedness and all, but that still shouldn’t happen. If he had a manuscript, or a detailed outline, she could have asked one of the men to simply read it,. If there was nothing, then one of the men should have simply closed in prayer. Better half an obedient sermon than a complete sermon finished off with disobedience,
Learning to Say No
I know Spurgeon has said something like, “Learn to say no. It will be of more use to you than to be able to read Latin.”
Have you found this to be true in your life? I am aware there are many applications of this sentiment, but, if you do hold something like this to be true, how does this also align with Jesus call for us to give our lives away? Doesn’t “finding our life by losing it” involve saying yes to a lot of exhausting things?
A related question to the above, what advice would you have for someone who wants to be better at making their yes, yes and no, no? I am asking because I want to be equally okay with saying no to people as I am to saying yes, but find that to be hard in person, or even on text messages. As I write this, I am struck with the obvious reason—fear of man—lingering around. Any thoughts to further understand the issue? Thanks in advance!CB
CB, the Christian life is a marathon, not a sprint. Learning to say no the way Spurgeon meant was not so that you could keep yourself cozy and untroubled, but rather so that you could pace yourself to run the whole distance.
Guests at Sabbath Dinner
I love the idea of Sabbath dinners and the way you start them with catechetical questions and the like. I’m curious about how you have approached having non-family attend these dinners. Have you allowed others to participate or have you implemented any sorts of boundaries to protect the space with your family? How have you thought about this?
Thank you,Chase
Chase, we have guests to our sabbath dinners frequently, and they just observe the regular goings-on.
Courtship for Widows
I hope you’re doing well. I just finished “Her Hand in Marriage,” and loved it. I hope you don’t mind me asking a scenario question:
Say a young Christian lady married a young Christian man at 20, but he passed away when she was 25 from a car accident. She, at 30, found another Christian man and wants to marry him. Does the new Christian man need to go through the same process she went through while courting the first husband?Curious One
Curious, the answer to that would be no. She would be her own household now, and can make her own decision. “The wife is bound by the law as long as her husband liveth; but if her husband be dead, she is at liberty to be married to whom she will; only in the Lord” (1 Cor. 7:39). The one possible exception would be if the widow were very young, and moved back into her father’s house to be provided for there. In the Old Testament, a young daughter of a priest was permitted to move back into her father’s house that way. But under all ordinary circumstances, an older widow is at liberty to make her own way.
Detaching Strings
I really appreciated your comments on in-laws. How would you counsel children who’s parents seem to often have strings attached?C.U.
C.U., I believe that if the strings are out there and obvious, then the husband of the younger couple needs to be the bad guy, and have the conversation that needs to happen. “The reason we can’t come to the lake this year is . . .” If the strings are very subtle, then he needs to take the lead in not cooperating with the steerage.
Married Names
My wife and I are recently married and are trying to think biblically about her full name, specifically regarding her maiden and middle name. We both believe it biblical for her to take my last name, but are not sure what to make her middle name. Should a wife retain her maiden name after marriage, either by legally making it her new middle name, or exclude it altogether from her full name and keep her current middle name now with my last name?
In one sense, I find myself thinking it biblical to forget the maiden name altogether by not making it a part of your new married name. This seems to mirror the pattern in Scripture of a man or woman becoming a Christian. God converts a man, and he IS a new man. He is no longer identified as who he was. In another sense, I see the retaining of the maiden name as showing or giving honor to the family name. John Piper seems to argue this from an Ask Pastor John episode. These are rough thoughts and I would greatly appreciate your help in thinking through this.Cody
Cody, as a general rule, I prefer seeing the wife simply take her husband’s name. That is her new identity. But there have been a handful of times over our decades of marriage when we have used Nancy’s maiden name in a middle position for purposes of simple identification. I don’t know, say you were working on a family tree, and found yourself wishing that your great, great grandmother had done that.
Canonical Reading
I remember in a post some time back you listed the books of “canonical history” or something like that (think Iliad and Odyssey). Could you provide that list below once more?
Thanks,Josh
Josh, the full list with comments is found in chapter 27 of my book, The Case for Classical Christian Education. The bare bones list is here: The Scriptures, The Iliad, The Odyssey, The Oresteia, The History of the Persian Wars (Herodotus), Oedipus Rex, The Republic, Nichomachean Ethics, The Aeneid, On the Incarnation, The Confessions of St. Augustine, Beowulf, The Divine Comedy, The Canterbury Tales, Hamlet, Macbeth, Henry V, Much Ado, Midsummer Night’s Dream (Shakespeare), Institutes of the Christian Religion, Vindiciae Contra Tyrannos, The Temple (Herbert), Paradise Lost, Pilgrim’s Progress, Pensees, Pride and Prejudice, Faust, The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn, The Brothers Karamazov, and The Lord of the Rings,
Modern Problems
My wife’s sisters family are quite enjoyable people who are quite progressive with some even more woke friends. They have kids; we have kids; and the cousins of like age (8-14 range) really enjoy hanging out. We failed to manage a camping trip with them last summer and the only option for that this summer is one my brother-in-law organized but also invited some of their friends along on. Those other friends are also rather woke, including 12-year-old boy who claims to be a trans girl.
My kids are not ignorant of these issues, as where we live and having family like that, we can’t avoid such people. They have indeed met this particular boy at cousin birthday parties. But the interactions have always been fairly limited. Spending several full days camping feels like another thing altogether. Skipping out on this is an option, but not without a familial relationship cost. We agreed to go before the others were invited. They know we have no conflict that week in our schedule. I don’t think we are going to get an “easy out”.
Do we go and prep the kids with prayer and teaching? Draw a line and say, “No, not this, not with them.”? Something else. We’re praying it over and seeking local counsel, but I’m very curious what you would recommend.A.T.
A.T. there are two factors to consider. One would be your evaluation of your kids’ maturity level in being able to navigate conversations with grace and truth.—and whether your in-laws would okay with your kids speaking about it kindly but plainly. That would be one thing, and so there answer there would be “it depends.” The second issue would be things like this boy wanting to be in the girls’ tent. That would be a hard no, relationship costs or not. But there is nothing wrong with interacting with people like this, depending on how your interact.
Modern Church Deficits
I hope you will address two questions pertaining to a problem my husband and I have observed worsening over the years in our church experience. First, being that we (the church) overwhelmingly believes we are currently (no longer) in danger, do you think this could mean we are in the most danger?
From On a Street Called Straight: “It follows that suffering is not a refutation of anything. It is frequently a confirmation of everything we say we believe. And this is why we must learn wisdom. We must learn to distinguish the kind of suffering that results from being like Jesus and the kind of suffering that results from refusing to be like Jesus. The sinful heart wants to blur the two and claim the noble status of “victim” whenever pain is experienced, for whatever reason.”
My husband and I know numerous people who have left their church of many years for a different church with the objective of having a “better church community.” Presently, we find ourselves in a similar situation where we have moved back to our hometown and could attend our former home church (of many years) but have decided not to because they are in the middle of a conflict. We have thrice attended another Reformed church (also an outcome of a church split) but there are circumstances causing us to feel like we are worshiping with a body of “dissenters”—ourselves included. We have been asked by other “displaced members” from our previous church, who also attend, if we know what is happening in our previous church. Conflict. We know no more than you. When my spouse and I discuss this at home, we question why another church in our community is losing its core members, but it comes with a strong feeling that we already know the answer. We venture to put it this way, borrowing from our own experiences, observations, and your article:
It follows that discomfort or real suffering, as a church body, is not a refutation of anything. It is frequently a confirmation of everything we say we believe and something we assume when we take our membership vows. And this is why we must learn to deal with conflict, especially relational conflict. We must learn to distinguish the kind of community that results from loving like Jesus (love with grip) and the apathy that results from refusing to be like Jesus (love without loyalty). The weak church wants to blur the two and claim the noble status of “unity” whenever pain is experienced, for the reason that ‘contrived love’ is the standard in a body that conditionally upholds, as truth, the facade that they are “good” or “fine” when this is Biblically false. When a member ends up in a “mess” where all can see, this becomes a breach of the facade.
Our experience has been that once this happens, such members start looking for another church. We have been able to ask several members in our previous church why they left. Their reasons don’t vary much, leaving us with a keen understanding that this may be a cultural problem having to do with (our) being loosely committed to our duty to love and serve one another. As one family put it: “We left after twenty plus years because our hospitality was rarely reciprocated and we needed community.” Another couple, who left after the husband repented publicly to adultery, said they had left for want of a closer community where they could bless others with their life experiences and story. Most recently, a wife confided in me that no one in our (previous) church knows the real reasons for why they moved.
We have moved several times over several years due to work, health, and other circumstances. No one has ever inquired into the reasons for these moves and publicly called one move stupid. We believe it is because our brethren prefer their own negative opinions for having a plausible reason to not invest further—we volunteer this experience because the “disinterest” is our concern, based on having similar shared experiences with others, and how our shared experiences begs a (our second) question: Do you believe the church (at large) in America is being sanctioned with evolving apathy (indifference, disinterest, coolness, passivity, lack of involvement) in judgment? Our understanding is that apathy is the opposite of Biblical love—not hate. Our experiences and observations are not limited to one community, but include several Reformed churches in the Northwest. Overall, we believe aloofness (the quality or state of being distant, detached, or emotionally reserved, often characterized by a lack of friendliness or interest in others) is the new status quo when it comes to Christian fellowship and apathy is its reward. Your thoughts?Mr & Mrs Anon
Mr. & Mrs, I obviously cannot speak to the particular situations in these various churches, but I can say that I believe that there is much in what you say.
Pastor,
Thank you for the insightful response to my letter, in which you said:
Andy, I agree with all of this. But if the worship of Molech gets entrenched in a sovereign state, “over there,” say, and they will not repent, we need a mechanism that would be the counterpart to secession—expulsion. That is because two cannot walk together unless they be agreed (Amos 3:3).
I 100% wholeheartedly agree.
Andy
CH, and once you’ve learned psalms as Doug suggests, you might consider using them along with ALL other (doctrinally sound) music genres, ancient to contemporary – in keeping with Ephesians 5:19’s exhortation to use psalms, hymns, AND spiritual songs…rather than adhering to extrabiblical biases or stubbornly exclusionary denominational traditions about your music selections. Could the teaching of Psalm 150 even inform your church music program? Thoughts to consider.
“Every man hath a psalm…” (I Cor 14.) Not just ‘the worship leader/worship committee/pastor’ hath a psalm/song or three or four. And if people other than the leaders can bring songs, some of their choices will differ from those of the most musically and/or spiritually mature–and that, tho it needed better regulation than Corinth, was OK. (Cf if something is revealed to the 2nd prophet, the first prophet must shut up and listen.) So someone in a congregation runs across some great piece of music. Is it like pulling teeth–lots of teeth–to get it sung, since the leader(s) are choosing… Read more »
I’ve been in a CREC church using Cantus for about a year. Cantus has a sound, one I respect, one my family seems to respect and sometimes like. So far so good. But if it’s not the only acceptable Christian worship sound, then Doug’s choice in music does not constitute THE reformation in music or THE Christian culture as opposed to cultural wickedness around us. And it seems happy to ignore, if not rule out, lots and lots of beautiful, reasonably devout and sensible music. I grew up on hymns and choruses and (60s/70s/80s)CCM; came to psalms later, via The… Read more »
The real issue that needs discussion is prenups for older married couples. If one spouse has an estate and dies, without a prenup, that person’s grown children are entitled nothing. The new spouse gets it all and that surviving spouse’s kids get both estates. My grandma married when I was a teenager. She died and her husband got the house, and his kids inherited everything. That is the law.
Regarding groomers: If you are being groomed by a predator, you will be tested. the predator wants to know where you are mentally. For example, do they borrow money and not pay it back? Will they through a firecracker in the middle of worship? (That actually happened) It will be outrageous or stupid or something like that, but whatever the tests are, they will be deliberate, not spontaneous. On the subject, I would recommend, The Devil Inside, by Jimmy Hinton.